NHL Rumor Mill – July 2, 2019

by | Jul 2, 2019 | Rumors | 166 comments

A look at the top remaining UFAs plus updates on the Penguins, Golden Knights, Predators, Oilers, and more in today’s NHL rumor mill. 

WHAT’S LEFT IN THE UFA MARKET?

SPORTSNET: Joe Thornton and Jake Gardiner are the notables among Luke Fox’s list of the notable remaining unrestricted free agents. Others include wingers Michael Ferland and Ryan Dzingel and defenseman Ben Lovejoy.

Jake Gardiner remains among the few notable players still available in the NHL UFA market (Photo via NHL Images).

SPECTOR’S NOTE: I’m expecting Thornton will sign a one-year, bonus-laden contract with the Sharks. Fox noted the Montreal Canadiens had interest in Gardiner. However, they’re in a holding pattern awaiting the Carolina Hurricanes’ response to their signing Sebastian Aho to an offer sheet.

Fox also said there’s some buzz suggesting the Calgary Flames would like to bring back Ferland. Flames general manager Brad Treliving said he’s still seeking improvement on the right side of his forward lines. We’ll see if there’s a fit there.

COULD THE PREDATORS SHOP TURRIS?

OTTAWA SUN: After the Nashville Predators signed Matt Duchene yesterday, Bruce Garrioch speculates the Nashville Predators could try again to trade Kyle Turris. He said they attempted to move the 29-year-old center during the draft. Garrioch acknowledges moving Turris’ $6-million annual salary-cap hit won’t be easy. However, he believes there are teams in the Eastern Conference that might need help at center.

SPECTOR’S NOTE: Not at $6 million per season. If the Predators want to trade Turris they could be forced to absorb part of his cap hit or include a good young player, a high draft pick, or a top prospect in the deal. 

PENGUINS MUST SHED MORE SALARY

TRIBLIVE.COM: After the Pittsburgh Penguins signed Branden Tanev to a six-year, $21-million contract, Jonathan Bombulie believes they must shed more salary. They have only $2.3 million in salary-cap space with restricted free agents Marcus Pettersson, Zach Aston-Reese and Teddy Blueger to re-sign. Bombulie speculates a forward like Nick Bjugstad or Bryan Rust could become a cap casualty. 

SPECTOR’S NOTE: Rust’s name recently surfaced in Penguins’ trade rumors. The Penguins acquired Bjugstad last season and could be reluctant to part with him. 

GOLDEN KNIGHTS SHOPPING GUSEV

THE ATHLETIC: Jesse Granger reports sources claiming the Vegas Golden Knights are shopping the rights of winger Nikita Gusev. The Golden Knights hoped to sign the KHL winger to a contract but the two sides remain far apart. With limited salary cap space, they could be forced to move him. 

LAS VEGAS SUN: Justin Emerson believes this will come down to how the Golden Knights view Gusev. If they feel he’ll become a top-six forward, they’ll sign him and clear cap space by moving another player like Cody Eakin, Ryan Reaves or Nick Holden. Otherwise, they might be better off shopping him for high draft picks. 

SPECTOR’S NOTE: Gusev is a highly skilled forward in his playing prime who could quickly become an NHL scorer. If his asking price is too high (Granger said they’re about $2 million apart) for Vegas, trading him appears their only suitable option. 

OILERS SEEKING A 20-GOAL WINGER

EDMONTON JOURNAL: David Staples reports Oilers GM Ken Holland remains in the market for a 20-goal winger for his second line. He wasn’t keen to pay what many of the UFA wingers received yesterday during the opening day of the free-agent market. Holland also said he spoke with teams regarding winger Jesse Puljujarvi, who recently requested a trade. However, he hasn’t seen anything yet that makes sense for the Oilers. 

SPECTOR’S NOTE: Cap Friendly indicates the Oilers have around $3.9 million in salary-cap space. Unless Holland swings a hockey trade that sees some salary heading out, he’ll be limited to bargain hunting in the UFA market. 

LIGHTNING TO MOVE DOMINGUE

THE ATHLETIC: Joe Smith reports the Tampa Bay Lightning’s signing Curtis McElhinney means backup Louis Domingue is on his way out. GM Julien BriseBois said they’re working on trading Domingue sooner rather than later. Domingue has a year left on his contract with a $1.1 million cap hit. 







166 Comments

  1. It is crazy to see how far Turris has regressed. Many saw Ottawa giving up the more well rounded center when they traded Turris for Duchene. But at 29, $6 million a year for the next 5 seasons it is hard to see who even considers taking on that contract! I think Nashville might have to hope a shift to the wing can help Turris out.

    I don’t know why, but the Aves, Islanders, & Oilers to me all feel like good destinations for Nikita Gusev.

    • Ottawa dealt Turris, not because of the money demanded (they offered as much), but the term. Poile relinquished both.

      Someone might have taken a shot at him in a trade if he had 2 years left on his deal – but not 5.

      For those who thought Ottawa had to (or should) take on a toxic contract like that of Lucic to reach the cap floor of $58.8 – note that they are now at $58,237,500 with RFAs Colin White and Christian Wolanin to settle. That will bring them to 21 players signed – so there’s still room for two more. Certainly, the elevation of players like Batherson, Bransstrom, Brown and maybe even Formenton if he makes it out of camp. could result in further movement of a Zack Smith and/or J-G Pageau later this summer/early fall.

      • I think MTL should request Turris with 1.5-2$m held for a 3rd rd pick from NSH if they do not get AHO. At 4-4.5 M Turris at 2C would do quite well for MTL and give them options at a very affordable rate.

      • IF he plays like he did at the World’s – yes. But that’s a whole different playing area than the comparative band-box of NHL rinks – and virtually NO hitting/body contact of any consequence.

      • Good point George

  2. Bryan Rust is all but sure to move. Every time Rutherford talks about the players not being as hungry as they used to be, he means Rust. I can’t remember the last time I saw him backcheck.

    A week (even a day) ago, I didn’t want to trade Rust because of his youth, speed and versatility…preferring to trade Kessel, Hornqvist or Bjugstad. But, Tanev replaces Rust’s skill set with louder ones at the same price. He gone.

    If that Puljujarvi deal is still on the table, Rutherford should grab it. He might have to take Brodziak’s contract back to make it work.

    —–

    I still don’t see a 3C in the mix for the Pens. McCann should be a top 6 winger and Bjugstad is not a center.

    Call Poile. Offer Hornqvist for Turris. If that doesn’t work, Bjugstad and Nick Bonino have the exact same term and AAV left on their deals. Seems like a W for a C swap works for both teams.

    ———

    Mike Smith was the Flames best (only good) player in the playoffs.

    Cam Talbot lost his job in EDM and then couldn’t even win a backup job in PHI.

    So, obviously, the Flames choose Talbot over Smith and pay him more. Can anyone explain that?

    ————–

    Why did the Islanders give Varmlamov Lehner’s money? What does Chicago know about Corey Crawford? Are the Jackets really going with a Joonas and Elvis tandem? Lots of goalie questions.

    • MG

      Re: Pens— GMJR has left it a bit muddy— see me diatribe and potential solutions below

      • The mud in the Igloo is actually because of Hornqvist, more than any other one player. Assuming a Rust or Bjugstad trade for a pick or non roster player, these are the best lines I see for the Pens….

        Guentzel Crosby Hornqvist
        Tanev Malkin Galchenyuk
        Kahun McCann Bjugstad/Rust
        ZAR Bleuger Simon

        These lines all have a good mix of speed, skill and grit. BUT…if Hornqvist is the guy who came back after his umpteenth concussion last year and didn’t score for (what?) 30 games or so and didn’t get involved in traffic much…then he becomes a 3rd or 4th line player and the rest gets jumbled.

        McCann Crosby Guentzel
        Tanev Malkin Galchenyuk
        Kahun Bjugstad Hornqvist

        That third line will get pinned in it’s own zone constantly and be one and done in the O zone all the time. If you trade Bjugstad instead…

        Guentzel Crosby Rust
        Tanev Malkin Galchenyuk
        Kahun McCann Hornqvist

        Looking at that, I think I’d trade Bjugstad first.

        Other than that Turris for Hornqvist idea, I don’t see any realistic trade scenarios for him, so the Pens season largely rests on whether he can rebound.

      • MG

        concur… Horny contract is a tough problem w.r.t. driving good lines.

        I like your first line of Sid, Guentz, McC … their best line IMO and should be used always if possible.

        Tough if Bjugstaad moves (but see my crazy move that has Bjug going but Staal coming back).

        If it is Rust moving (and it is appearing more and more like that) for Cap reasons and they have to keep Horny, then I’d keep Bjugstad as 3 C so that McC can stay with Sid and Guentzel; and move Horny down the list.

        so sticking with what you had and keeping Bjugstaad at 3C; ….

        Sid Guentz, McC

        Geno, G-Chuck, Tanev

        Bjug, Kahun , Simon or Horny

        Blueger, ZAR, Simon or Horny

    • Hey MG, The Isles going with Varlemov over Lehner boggles me. Some speculation that Varlemov is good friends with Serokin who the Isles hope is the goalie of the future starting next season. Feels like a big risk for a maybe when you had a goalie that clearly fit with your system.

      • I hadn’t heard that info. Thanks. That’s at least a reason.

        Debatable as to whether it’s a good one, but…

        I appreciate the Isles, Canes and Jackets actively weakening their teams to give the Pens more wiggle room in the regular season, though. NJ is getting the attention, but I think NYR is the bigger threat to take a playoff spot next year. Every little bit helps.

  3. It was refreshing to see an oilers GM not over pay on mid level UFAs yesterday since we did not have cap to go after the bigger fish. Depth moves help us, but I fully expect Holland to land a valid top 6 winger through trade before the season starts. I expect the trade will need to include a top prospect plus to get any real value though

    • 1oiler fan

      Is there a trade with VGK available to get Gusev? There is the 20 G winger needed

      • Pengy mg…….j j rust jarry and maybe hornqvist all go.. mg i like your idea hornqvist for turris…he played well at the world championships as did hornqvist…salaries almost identical.. move rust johnson and jarry thats $7.5 million sign michael ferland and Winnipeg ufa dman 28 year oild ben chiarot pair him with schultz

    • maybe Holland learned from mistakes in Detroit-
      also Yzerman looks like he is prizing defense much more-

  4. I’ve mentioned Namestikov before as a possible fit in Edmonton. He had 20 goals in 62 games playing with Stamkos and Kucherov. Puljujarvi would be a good fit for Rangers young team. Perhaps Rangers would retain a million. Rangers need to make a trade after signing Panarin. Only 8-9 million of cap space left and still need to sign Trouba, Buchnevich, DeAngelo and Lemeaux…

    • Smith has to be buried in Hartford. Names has to be moved. Staal and Shattenkirk stay. Shatty IR by nov 1

      • DS, I think Smith will be bought out. Sending him down saves less than a million which gets eaten up by one of the young D on ELC… wonder if a Shattenkirk for Turris deal could work. Turris has the extra 3 years on his deal, but we’ll be done with Staal and Lundqvist contracts by then (among others). Nashville was one of the leagues worst on PP and with Subban gone Shatty could be a fit there. Maybe with the extra years Nash agrees to retain a million?

      • @ Slick
        We missed the buyout date for Smith though?

        Please not Turris.

      • ds

        Buyout window only on hiatus— a glimmer of hope for me with Pens and JJ.

        window opens up again if an RFA on team goes to Arb

      • So it’s been announced that Carolina will match Montreal’s offer. Could the Habs make a play for Point next?

  5. Maybe the one still-unsigned UFA that puzzles me – and yet it doesn’t – is Ryan Dzingel. Here;s a 27 y/o C/F, 6′ 190 lbs, blazing speed, who in his first 3 full seasons, went from 14 18 32 to 23 18 41 to 26 30 56 (the last with Ottawa & Columbus) and whose cap hot was a paltry $1.8 mil. And no takers yet.

    Perhaps it’s his reluctance to be responsible defensively combined with an unrealistic demand is causing teams to shy away. It’s clear Dorion has no intention of trying to bring him back to Ottawa.

    With what’s gone down so far I like what Colorado and Dallas have done. They will be serious contenders next year.

    • Being a healthy scratch in the playoffs brought down Ryan Dzingel’s stock. And Columbus could use a similar player who they obviously do not want back

    • I like what Colorado has done and agree they should be a serious contender. The Stars, not so sure. Pavelski will help, but big question marks on Perry and Sekera. A couple of rough seasons for both Sekera is great value at 1.5 for 3rd pairing but he should be viewes as such. At this point Perry is a bottom 6 winger. If either or both come back close to past forms then yes but if both continue with current trajectory as i expect, the signings for me do not propel the Stars that much from where they were.

      • 1oilerfan

        Agree with you if trajectory continues. However, I don’t believe that will happen (gut feeling???)— as at now; I think Dallas made the best moves relative to their position at end of season

      • What Pavelski and Perry WILL do is make the other players perform at their best all the time. There are some notorious “coasters” on the Stars but with those two around now to prod them the whole team should benefit.

  6. Comments on Ottawa’s moves George or did I miss that in yesterday’s column comments?

    • Heh. Yeah, they’re buried somewhere in that flurry of comments yesterday

  7. It’s been reported that Ceci will accept the qualifying offer of $4.2? for one season hence making him a UFA next season. Realize it’s a year away and lots of time to sort itself out; Come next season as it stands the leafs will have only one defenseman Reilly signed. Lots of work to be done.

    • He’s lucky they even qualified him at all.
      I didn’t think they would.
      It becomes a full “walk away” if they don’t and gets Dubby even more cap space.

      The money movement is a massive win for Dubby, the players themselves are a wash. Only reason to qualify CC is to see if maybe MAYBE on a better offensive team and a fresh start he lives up to some potential? The sweetners are a wash too. Brown = 3rd pick. This whole thing was two Ontario teams trading trash. Ottawa as usual gets the bag with the stinkier smelling stuff.

      • At least they have Hainsey and Ennis to show for ex Maple Leafs that moved down the highway on July 1 also

      • Ottawa does not get the bag with smelling stuff, they both do and in this case if not for the desperate need for cap space (a negative need btw) the Leafs are holding a bigger bag of turds.

        The Leafs will have 3 of their 6 defenders due for new contracts next year. That’s not great but nothing urgent as they can correct that over the year but not a great position.

        Z’s $4.5m per year will be close to the cost of a good third pairing defense man before his contract expires. The catch is is he gonna be a liability or not. Either case, you got brown who will be a fan favorite by game 1.

      • He already is, Ron. In a straw poll on Team 1200 radio this morning, in response to the question “which newcomer do you see making the greatest impact” Brown is polling close to 70%!

      • How is Brown = 3rd round pick?
        An established NHLer, former 20 goal scorer who also plays on the pp?
        Its not his fault that he had 4th line minutes after putting up 20.
        Brown is the key piece in the deal and the sacrifice that had to be made to unload Zaitsev, you take out the 3rd and Brown and Dorion laughs in Dubas’ face

      • He was certainly the key to the deal going down. Fans in the area who aso follow the Ottawa 67s of the OHL well remember him leading the league in scoring in 2013-14 with 68gp for Erie Otters with 45g 83a 128pts and a whopping +44. 29 pts more than McDavid including 17 goals more, and way better than any of Domi, Bennett and Horvat for example.

        Now I am NOT suggesting he is better than – or even remotely close to – McDavid at the NHL level, but that 20 goal season had to be followed up with more 2nd line responsibility and game minutes – kind of like Kadri dropped to 3rd line duty after two 32-goal seasons. Made little sense – in hindsight.

        I do believe we are about to see how good both can be in new locations and with more minutes added to their games.

      • typical sens fans always think you get gold hey taz i can’t wait for 2 to 3 yrs when ottawa has to pay it all out

      • Typical Sens fan???? Have you been on Mars? Hell man, all I did was illustrate some facts. Read into them what you want.

      • look at the comment george i said taz

  8. Boston signing Clifton for 3 year extension yesterday and earlier signed Kampfer. Both these players are 5’11” add Krug and Grzelcyk both at 5’9″ that’s a lot of small on the back end.
    The Bruins will have 9 NHL defenseman under contract once Carlo and McAvoy sign. Something got to give.
    I believe Krug is on his way out of town, but Sweeney doesn’t want to make the move until he has Carlo and McAvoy under contract (Bridge deal) if the deal is made prior this may lead to one or both players wanting a long term deal now, if they don’t already.

    • Agree with Krug maybe being traded for a 2nd line goal scorer with size….

  9. The draft to July 1 did not disappoint . Not sure if the Leafs are keeping Kerfoot. If so the Kadri salary saving will be probably be a wash this year.
    Good job Dumbass. Now don’t over extend with Marner. Single digits !

    Dzingle will land . I was sure he would stay with the Jackets. He went to Ohio state. Probably not happy being a healthy scratch.
    Could be a fit with the Flames. Same with Ferland .

    • Does the aho offer sheet help leafs with marner or no impact?

      • I would say it has no impact on Marner because the value was surprisingly so low for Aho. Carolina is going to wait until the last day to keep Aho and do Montreal no favours which I think is hilarious (and the right thing to do).

      • can Aho sign another offersheet while he waits?

      • No.

    • Kerfoot comes with a good rep, he should be the 3rd line centre.
      I thought Boston might do more – guess they’re set.

      • “Right thing to do” only Leafs fan could say something stupid. But I’m also not surprised.

  10. Bruins spent roughly 5 mil for the 19-20 season on depth and junk…maybe they could have signed Ferland who would’ve helped them for less than what they spent yesterday

    • “K” you must be a Habs fan if you think it’s stupid for them to use any legal tactic to stick it back to the team trying to sign away one of their best players. Typical sports fan, gets butt hurt when it hurt’s their team but when it helps their team they don’t care what the case is.

      Try and be a little more unbiased moving forward.

      • Nah I would have to be a Leaf. No I’m not habs fan…nice try.
        Also players are coming and going, the best and the worst.
        But it would be only interesting to watch, what would happened if they didnt match (unfortunately they did).
        It’s just lame how you want to do this…wait till the end so they wont sign anyone else. Classy as always leads, as always…

  11. The other day Tower took me to task for my observations on the Leafs cap situation just before confirmation of the deal with Ottawa saying “George. I think you are the one that needs to give your head a shake. Currently without another trade leafs have enough to sign Marner for $11 million. They have currently 5.5 m plus Horton 5.5. That takes care of Marner. They are trading Zaitsev. That’s 4.5 m. They already signed Rosen, Hutchinson, Johnson and Kaps. After Marner signs at $11 m they have two spots not 6 to fill and have 4.5 million left not taking into effect potential Nylander trades. So with all due respect yadda yadda yadda”

    Well, now that the dust has stettled, CapFriendly shows the Leafs with 22 signed, which includes Harpur, Marincin, Gravel, Holl, Shore, Petan, Gauthier, Agostino all factoired in and with cap space of $11,065,301. I would assuime at least 2 of those will wind up in the AHL once the contracts of RFAs Ceci, Marner and Kerfoot are settled. Ceci is reportedly going to be extended for 1 season at $4.5 and Kerfoot, if he’s to be kept at the NHL level, will get some sort of increase over his previous $925,000 – say a minimum of $1.2 mil (to be optimistic). That combined $5.7 reduces their cap space to $5,365,301 so, even adding in the full $5.3 of Horton, that gives themn just $10,665,301 to sign Marner.

    As for the Horton money, here’s an explanation taken off the web in that regard “The Leafs won’t necessarily get all $5.3 million. They’ll get only the portion they need on the day they need it and then only that much for the rest of the season (or as long as Horton is on LTIR). So if the cap is $83 million and on opening night, the Leafs have $80 million in AAV (including Horton), they won’t need to put Horton on LTIR. If the cap is $83 million and the Leafs have $85 million in AAV, then they would put Horton on LTIR and get cap grace of $2 million. So in essence, if the cap is $83 million, the Leafs can start the season with a roster (including Horton) with an $88.3 million AAV and by putting Horton on LTIR they will be cap friendly.”

    Yadda, yadda, yadda indeed.

    • Kerfoot will get atleast 3 million from what is being said

      • Comparing the stats of Kerfoot with those of Kapanen and Johnsson it seems likely that ge gets about the same money.

      • As I said Bigbadbruins, “being optimistic” (from the Leafs perspective) … you are probably bang on at around $3 mil so that adds another $1.8 mil to what I showed above when Ceci is extended, making signing Marner even more problematic. Someone else has to go from that Leafs roster.

      • So are your (both of you) solution is do what exactly? Isn’t a GM supposed to improve the team? Two factors plagued the Leafs – lack of cap space and right side D.

        They’ve done what most fans like to see albeit on the high side their star players. The thing this team lack most of period. They don’t have replacement players on long and bloated contracts, they

        I’m on the side that the Leafs made a bunch of sideways moves that allows them to gain some cap space but not nearly what I was hoping for with my limited insight in their business.

        The market dictates all.

      • As I say, Ron, (and while NOT criticizing what he’s done so far – in fact, so far so good) the math doesn’t yet add up to get Marner signed, especially after Ceci’s extension kicks in and Kerfoot is signed. My observation was to simply point out that another cap move needs to be made so that they don’t find themselves with just about every cap nickle accounted for and no room to adjust in the event of injuries that are not long term. In past years I think there were a couple of teams that found themselves in that position (Chicago? NJ?) and so had to play a clutch of games with a reduced bench because the cap wouldn’t allow them to elevate someone from the AHL. Everyone needs “wiggle room” to some degree.

      • The Leafs have made some good short term moves but its the long ones that are concerning.
        If they do send to the cap this year then what is next year looking like?
        How are they replacing Muzzin and Barrie who combined add up to less than 7 Million? And yes, I’m taking in account that Horton comes off the books, they need that space now to sign Marner, Kerfoot and Ceci.
        What about the year after when Hyman and Freddy come up?

        Better hope the cap is at 90M when 2022 rolls around

    • Hey everybody thanks for continuing to use my yadda, yadda, yadda comment! I got wrong initially as Chrisms pointed out:). The Leafs management will figure this out and we will sign Marner. Yesterday we greatly improved our team! We will start the year with Reilly, Muzzin, and Barrie (and Dermott in November) on D. The area we need improvement on is improving greatly. Last year we started with Reilly, Hainsey!, Gardiner, and Zairsev (sheesh)! I was talking to a New Jersey Devil fan yesterday and he thought we hadn’t improved on defence! Mind you it was Canada Day and he was drinking. How that is not an improvement blows my mind! Oh yes and we also have Ceci and Harpur. Our defensive depth improved exponentially yesterday!

      • Your welci

      • You swapped zaitsev and gardiner with Barrie and Ceci. Improvement, sure, i’d take Barrie and Ceci over the former, but imo it is only a marginal upgrade. All in all i like the moves the leafs made, working through the cap issues but dont see them as vastly improved.

        Anyone else think they are going to miss kadri more than they think? The one or two annual Bonehead actions aside

    • George,

      Any idea on what the Leafs cap space was a week ago? Might be helpful to see how much room Dumbas got….or lost.

      excellent post btw

      • I believe, Ron, that – as things stand now as pointed out above – they had potentially more cap space then than now – but at that time they had yet to confirm the Kapanen – Johansson signings. Dubas has done OK to this point – but simple math and limits on what portion of the Horton contract he can actually use, dictate that another roster move must be made.

  12. What would happen if Carolina decided to trade Aho as he is under an offer sheet…would the team that acquires him be allowed to reject and accept the picks offered by Montreal? Is this even allowed? Or does Carolina have to accept or decline the offer sheet?

    • They could in theory work out a trade that gets announced as soon as they match the offer sheet right?

      • No, they cannot trade Aho for one year if they match. However, they could try to trade those draft picks back to Montreal for a package with a player included.

      • thanks Lyle

  13. Don’t you think Carolina would match quickly to send a positive message to Aho?

    • No. Delaying the response ties mtl’s hands and limits their ability to do much else until a response. They put the canes in this situation so its best to leave them squirm. Aho and the canes will have plenty of time to smooth over any hurt feelings

    • It’s all business at this point, they lowballed him to begin with so I can see why he signed an offer sheet to force their hand. At the end of the day he knew there was a possibility that Carolina could match the offer sheet and maybe that’s what he wants deep down. I don’t see any reason Carolina should match it quickly.

      • If carolina can afford to match it, lots of money in first 12 months, i could see them accept and trade him right away. But montreal’s hands aren’t totally tied while waiting as they can spend 10% above salary cap during summer, but it’s a bit of a risk to spend the money and carolina not match then they would have to trade money away before beginning of season

      • If the Hurricanes match the offer, they cannot trade Aho for one year.

      • BBB, It isn’t a coincidence that Aho’s agent reps 8 of the Habs players? and if the Habs suck it affects his commission?..Really? If the Canes/NHL dig they could find and prove collusion on Aho’s agent and Bergevin easy.

  14. I read this page everyday and see there are many folks on here that profess to have sound knowledge of how the NHL works. If you could, would someone please help me understand this money question….
    We have three players that each sign contracts for 5 million dollars….
    Player A signs with team that has no state tax…
    Player B signs with team that has state and applicable taxes.
    Player C signs with Canadian team.

    My question is…how much actual money will each player receive in their pocket. for their one year contract.

    Are Canadian contracts negotiated in US or Canadian dollars ?

    I value your opinions and look forward to your replies.
    Thank you…….An Old Hockey Fan….

    • I believe that all contracts are paid in US dollars. Each player pays taxes relative to the city they play in (and many cities often tax visiting athletes, too) during the season. What I don’t know is whether they also pay taxes based on where they live and how that works.

      What I do know is that the cap was supposed to create a level (as possible) playing field and we now see that teams in Florida, Texas, etc have real persistent advantages.

      Here’s what the NHL needs to do…they can pay someone to work out the fine details, but basically…

      Based the cap on after tax pay.

      So, (making up numbers to make it easy to illustrate) if $10 million is only worth $6 million in Montreal after taxes but the player takes home $8 million in Vegas on the same salary, that player would count $6 million against the Habs cap but $8 million against the Knights cap.

      It would be messy and complicated and imperfect. Again, there might be issues with taxes deducted based on residency. And there would be issues with pre tax deductions, etc (do NHL players have 401k’s? I have no idea) but even if it’s imperfect, it would still be closer to fair than the current system where sun belt teams have a huge advantage over Canadian and CA teams.

      • MG

        Along those lines of thinking and knowing trades complicate all formulae and Caps would float up and down with each trade; a mathematically simpler way would be to have a different team cap in each Tax bracket.

        There is no way they would do it but it would be something like :

        First figure out the 31 team average after tax percentage and thread out a scaled formulaic Cap for each team relative to the norm.

        Example, if norm/average is 53% take home then any franchise with that tax hit gets exactly 81.5 M as Cap ceiling (using 2019 as the example year). If you are in a City heavier hit with taxes then you get a higher cap

        So say Tor/Ottw/Mon have 47% take home … .53 (avg.) divided by .47 times 81.5… Cap of 91.9M

        Vegas, Dallas, TBay, Panthers, Nash— at 62%… they then get .53/.62 * 81.5… 69.7M Cap

        Would that mitigate tax advantages; yes. Would it ever happen…. Nyet Nyet and more Nyet.

        Perhaps there is a hybrid solution that they can come up with in next CBA. Getting 32 different minds agreeing on it will be seriously difficult.

        I believe it is very likely to go unchecked and unchanged and that disparity complaints will continue.

        I’d like to be proven wrong on that.

      • You are correct weather and taxes matter most look around.

    • Off the top of my head…I could be wrong on some of this but as I understand it.

      All contract figures are in US dollars.

      State taxes do indeed affect take home pay, so a player signing in Florida, Texas or Nevada would have a higher net pay than someone signing in a state with state income taxes or in Canada.

      Some states do have state taxes that are close to those in Montreal or Toronto…I think California and New York have particularly high state income taxes. I also believe that NYC has an additional city property tax.

      • Income tax not property tax….

    • Hi AHOF

      All players paid in $US

      Basically $5M in TBay, FLA, Dall, Nsh and Vegas will have a take home pay of just over $3M. Other teams will have less take home pay, with the worst being in Tor, Ottw and Mon where the take-home will be much closer to $2,0M (I believe in the $2.2M range… I have the spreadsheet somewhere and I will try and dig it up)

      Huge disparity anyway

      • In Canada the tax rate varies by province as well. Just like the US does by state.
        All provinces have income taxes, and they vary quite a bit.
        Alberta is the lowest by a considerable amount.
        Also no sales tax in Alberta.
        Alberta actually competes favorably with states like FLA and NEV when it comes to disposable income, as per Ron’s point regarding exchange. Revenue in US$ and expenses in CDN$.

    • It’s simple really. They all pay about the same amount of federal taxes give or take a few points. The only difference is state tax which saves you i think around 7-12% based on the state. Also note all players are paid in $US and if you’re playing on a Canadian team, you’ll pay slightly more in taxes but you gain in the exchange. I think (it was an option for me) if an American or Canadian is playing outside their home country they can choose to pay American or Canadian taxes based on what they claim as their home is. In no way it’s been ages a and bags of saving one way or the other. It’s a nice chunk of change but not at all a life changer.

    • AOHF , all contracts are in USD.

    • AOHF

      Found the old spreadsheet (info was as of ’18, so can’t be that far off now)

      Basically take-home rounding percentages: Toronto, Ottw and Mont lowest (rounded at 47%— $2.35M); and the Florida teams, Nsh, Vegas and Dallas rounded about 62% …. $3.1M in take home pay

      Put another way…. take Marner (and all else equal in when SB paid and proportionately how much is SB and how much is Sal) …. a 5 year $11 M Cap contract with Leafs is the same as a 5 year $8.34M Cap contract with Bolts, Panthers, Stars, Knights and Preds

      Another one …. for Vegas’ Stone Contract $76M for 8 years [$9.5 M Cap ann.], for Stone to be on equal footing in Ottw the Cap would have had to be $12.5M; and Ottw would have had to pay him $100M $USD over 8 years

      Huge disparity

      • Thanks for your time Pengy. From a business standpoint why do Canadian business people pursue such a biased play field ????
        I thought Edmonton and Winnipeg had trouble attracting players because of the cold weather…

        An Old Hockey Fan

      • Pengy, is AB on your spreadsheet? Would like to see that comparison if it is.
        How bout them Riders?

      • Ray Ray Ray

        I cried myself to sleep last night …. late and after a 2 hour rain delay

        I was at Argos home opener

        To Alex Trebek… “A Better O Line; Better D Line; a smarter coach for $500 Alex”

        Response: What is it that Toronto Argonauts need?

        🙁

        From the SS… rounding … Ed and Cgy teams take home at 52%

        Cheers

      • Thanks Pengy.
        Ya, Argos didn’t look good yesterday.
        Nowhere but up from here I guess.

    • here is a rough breakdown of personel income tax rates by province if a player was making 10 million Canadian or 6.8 million US;
      Note this includes provincial and federal tax

      BC – 49.5 %
      Alberta – 47 %
      Manitoba – 50 %
      Ontario – 53 %
      Quebec – 53%

      I didn’t look up what each US state is taxed at, but the top US federal tax rate is 37 % that all players would pay as a minimum plus the state tax where applicable

    • Please forgive me Lyle if I am committing a no no mentioning another site, but the Athletic did a very good article on this very topic. Tax rates were given at 38% for cities with no state taxes and the highest taxes cities came in at 52%. While the rates vary it is also pointed out that taxes are much higher in California and Canada, there are more opportunities for endorsements in those cities like Toronto or LA because they are bigger more high profile cities. So in some ways it’s a wash. Hope it helps.

  15. Ok

    Exciting day yesterday. Lots of moves, signings, ups and downs

    To me: The day’s winner was Dallas and I like the sneaky move by Chi to get Lehner. Happy but still hesitant on the end result for Leafs. Pens still have moves to make.

    Re: Mon— I think great move; wrong offer. Tough to think Car won’t match it.

    One of my VPs this morning brought up a point I completely missed…. Montreal STILL (right now) can do another offer sheet. They do NOT have to wait until the Aho decision. Due to the new rules that the top end offer (netting 4 firsts… must be your own) can be paid out over a 5 year period; Mon has all of their next 5 first rounders so only 2020 is tied up right now in the Aho offer sheet. If Bergevin still wanted to offer sheet someone else for a top tier set of picks (4 firsts) ; he has the space (can as at now go 10% over Cap ) and picks… interesting

    Re: Dubas’ moves… I like them. I still would have moved WW for a top 4 RHD , mid 20s with term; and at same time freeing up more space. Moves all good but will have 3 UFA D to deal with next summer and still Dubas still has to move out a player to finish the signing of MM, Ceci and Kerfoot (even moving Horton…. leaves $16.4M— not enough for the 3). Still, Kudos to GMKD

    Now compare Dubas (at 33) to future Hall of famer (more than double his age and with many many years experience) Jimmy R; and Dubas is coming out much wiser and shrewder.

    • Also like Chicago’s move to get Shaw for basically a 2nd RD pick.
      Seems cheap when you consider MTL didn’t have a cap problem. Shaw is a good and proven player on a good contract.

  16. Now Pens and GMJR—– ?????

    I’ve absolutely no issue with the Phil trade (I think he could have moved earlier on this and got more and also moved JJ) but Pens got younger; and Phil will not need to be protected (in lieu of younger better players) for the expansion draft (when he’d start that year at 34).

    I like the addition of Tanev. I really do. This will be an excellent add and his type of commodity was lacking on the team. AAV not a concern for me. I am concerned much more with term. Strange that he couldn’t get that AAV for less term? Setting that aside; Pens still have JJ. They have no chance at a cup with him playing regularly. So, move him or sit him or waive him to WBS (no team will pick him up) and save $750K on the Cap when he is burried; or Mofo Jimbo, roll up your sleeves and get a deal done that rids Pens of him.

    No matter what, someone has to go as there is not enough space left to sign the RFAs. It seems from Media reports that it is likely Rust. I would love for a move out that includes JJ. To me, absolutely imperative. Note: I think Horny is past his prime, but will be a tough move.

    So…. This is the craziness that Jimbo has left himself with as a solution type:

    1) Rust OR Bjugstaad (a Minneapolis lad BTW) plus JJ to Wild for Spurgeon (frees up an additional $1.6M – $2.2M and team immediately better!!)

    2) Rust Or Bjugstaad and JJ for Rask (50% retained); frees up $4.75 to $5.35 M; but now Pens with Rask for 3 more years. Possible change of scenery and he improves— possible, but small possibility.

    OR the penultimate ALL-In move:

    3) Bjug + Rust + ZAR + JJ for Staal + Spurgeon ($2 M retained) + 2nd … leaving $6.0M to sign Petterson ; Blueger and another Fwd.

    That team (with Sid, Geno, Staal , Blueger down the centre) and with the addition of Spurgeon…. Certainly, IMO, has a very fair shot at a deep Cup run.

    Absolute craziness right now

    I repeat…. all is saved and no one has to be moved; if JJ is bought out…. just sayin’

    • Did the Pens lose to the Islanders because of Jack Johnson?

      • Duh. It was pretty obvious that it wasn’t Crosby Malkin letang or Phil’s fault. They were dominate.

      • Hi MG

        I know you and I don’t see eye to eye w.r.t. JJ

        Sorry about that.

        This site is for sharing insights and opinions and informative banter. I enjoy it tremendously and value all people’s viewpoints. This site is a blast and is very refreshing reading.

        I knew going in that I run the risk of differing in my viewpoints from other Leafs and or Pens fans. Unfortunately, here I differ with you.

        So…..I humbly apologize, but I do feel very negatively and remain firm on my opinions w.r.t. JJ.

        Re: your question w.r.t. did JJ directly cause the series loss to Isles. No. Note as an aside he only played in 3 games.

        Did he have a serious and negative influence on the outcome of the series. Yes IMHO , he most definitely did.

        Fist of all due to his play through the season and him directly and individually causing some losses… Pens finished with less points than they should have had and would have had without JJ; and there first round opponents would have been different . In addition, they would have had home ice advantage; that is on JJ IMO.

        Game 1: No JJ. Huge push for first 10 minutes by Isles then thwarted by Pens. Massive and dominant play by Pens there onward in game. Two gaping net misses and Lehner basically stealing the game; an OT loss — Pens down 0-1 in series.

        Game 2—
        JJ direct cause of one goal. JJ has two stupid penalties; first one when Pens were pounding the onslaught against Isles and then he gets another absolutely stupid penalty as he comes out of the box. Influence on the outcome of that game. Yes.

        Game 3
        Directly caused 2 goals. So yes, I would put that as heavily influencing the loss in that game.

        Down 0-3 in series; series basically over.

        Did he directly cause the loss of the series; no. Did his play heavily influence the outcome of the series. IMHO. Absolutely.

        I mostly watch Pens and Leafs games (miss only a handful of all of their games a year; last year I think I missed 2 Pens games and 2 Leafs games). I watch probably another 100 NHL regular season games a year. I watch tons of playoff games. Every year I probably watch another 100 or so games that are not NHL (World’s, Juniors, Spengler, University).
        I played for many years and coached for many. I’ve watched hockey for 5 plus decades.

        In all that time, I have never ever seen a player so negatively influential on a team’s performance. He is just that bad.

        I would take Hunwick over him 100 times out of 100 and those hear know about my feelings on Hunwick.

        I’m jaded. I’m biased. No disagreement on that. It is what it is.

        Opinions by their nature of course are subjective, I get it. I back my opinion only with my eyeball, viewing so many games over 5 plus decades and from the repetitive stats that show how bad he is. Just an opinion. I could be wrong, just feel strongly that I am not.

        I get that I’m not in line with some on this and I apologize that I differ so vastly with you on this. However, it is truly what I feel.

        I do realize that Pens have been consistent with the precedent that they have set re: buyouts. Times are changing, and each team needs to dynamically and with great agility; shift gears and mindset just to keep up.
        There is not now; nor has there ever been; a better situation for a buyout. Immediately freeing up $3M and making the team better in the immediacy and in the future.
        The most recent window closed at 5 PM Sunday. I’m hoping for an Arb for one of the RFAs so that the window opens up again.

        Will GMJR do this— unfortunately he has proved very stubborn on this and has publicly defended JJ in despite the massive push back by fans (and I suspect , by some team members and possibly coaches [nothing to back that up, just a gut feeling]).

        Again, I apologize for being so overtly different in my thinking from you w.r.t. JJ. However, I am firm in my feelings on this.

        Can Pens make playoffs this upcoming year with JJ in the line up as a regular. Yes they can. Can they win the cup with him as a regular. IMHO, under no circumstances can this happen.
        Pens (and therefore GMJR’s) focus should be on trying to win another cup and not just towards getting to the playoffs. With that in mind; I stick with my repeated mantra of ridding Pens of JJ.

        Cheers

        Pengy

      • We don’t have to have the same views. I’m just trying to understand why you and so many (the majority I’d say) of Pens fans think Johnson is so bad.

        Not saying he’s great or even good. If I could wave a magic wand and make his contract disappear I would because I think there are a few bargains still out there right now but I’m not seeing where he hurts us anywhere close to where most fans believe. Perhaps I’m missing something.

        He was on the ice for 3 goals against vs. the Islanders. Two of those goals, it was Justin Schultz making the key miscue. On the third, he, Schultz and Cullen all could have done better. He is far from the reason we lost to the Isles.*

        He was very bad his first month or so. He was also with a new team and playing on the right side.
        After being moved back to the left, he got better and then was solid. Sometime around Xmas, he was moved back to the right for while and struggled again. Once Schultz came back, they were good together. For a month or so, when the team played it’s best hockey of the year, Letang and others were out and Johnson and Schultz were our top pair. I don’t see how a team can play it’s best hockey of the year with such an awful player on their top D pairing…unless he’s not as bad as people think.

        Johnson was a plus player in five of his seven months with the Penguins.

        So, what am I missing?

        Also…just FTR, Johnson played on our top pair for long stretches of winning hockey. Matt Hunwick couldn’t crack the Sabres D corps. There is no comparison.

        *The reason we lost to the Isles was we didn’t have NEARLY enough of what Brandon Tanev brings, so even if the prices isn’t ideal, Rutherford correctly identified what the team needs and got it.

      • I’m trying to remember when during those Jj on the ice goals the pens had their goalie pulled? Could either of you gentlemen refresh my memory?

      • Pengy is hardly the only Pens fan who thinks Johnson is doom. I’ve made the mistake of reading the DK comments lately. And it turns out, I even have some Johnsonpocolypse believers in my own family. So I went back and watched the extended highlights of each game to see if I missed where he doomed us…

        I disregarded PP goals (I think there only two of them, both of which 8 and 58 were on the ice) and empty net goals. So at even strength…

        Dumo was on the ice for 5 against. Letang and Schultz were on for 4. Johnson for 3. Gubrandson, Petterson and Maatta were all on for 2.

        I didn’t count, but I saw Phil on the ice for a lot of those goals.

        Obviously, poor play can extend beyond just goals against, but…the reality is that the Pens had many issues that caused them to be embarrassed out of the playoffs. Johnson wasn’t the least of them, but he was hardly the biggest and certainly not an insurmountable abyss in the lineup.

        Their main problem was they had zero tenacity. JR is doing his best to address that given a tight cap and limited movable assets.

      • Hi MG

        Sorry just reading your response now. Was tied up later yesterday and until now today; and unfortunately, I will be full for balance of today. Wanted to respond quickly here.

        I’m never challenging the man’s charisma, heart, grit, strength; none of his physical skills.

        I’ve no idea if he is liked or disliked in the dressing room. I would think we would have heard about it if he was. I’m guessing that he is likeable.

        He tries hard; there is no doubt in my mind. He has all the physical skills and attributes. His downfall unfortunately is that he is an extremely poor (I believe the worst) cerebral NHL player. He positions himself incorrectly many many times a game. Many times a game he is literally within arms length of his own D partner. Many times a game he follows towards his own D partner into his (D partner’s) corner to chase the puck; often leaving a player open in front of Murray or De Smith. He has big trouble on 2 on 1’s and when he positions himself between shooter and his goalie he is often brutally screening. If he stayed consistently in line ; Murray or De Smith could peak around and possibly pick up the puck. He doesn’t do that; often a fraction of a second before the shot he moves with the shot to screen more (in other words, Murray and/or De Smith are looking around Jj and picking up the puck and shooter and then JJ shifts for a full eclipse at the very last minute; which gets a shot on the net and sometimes it goes in). He also panics and makes incorrect impromptu mistakes when the puck is passed laterally. Finally, he takes bone head penalties at the most inopportune times.

        Again, the man has fortitude, strength, determination, grit and enough speed. He certainly has the size and an abundance of strength. He can block shots and he can hit. He is not an offensive threat but he was never expected to be. He does have difficulty moving the puck up ice but that is certainly the only physical skill that he has trouble with. His want to play and his efforts are unchallengeable. He is bad because he just doesn’t think the game correctly and positionally he is a huge detriment to the team.

        I stand by my statement that the team can’t win the cup with him as a regular. There would have to be an act of God type change of playing style for him to improve to the point that he is not a detriment to the team. I have to lay some blame on Sully. Sully sat JJ for one single shift the entire year. That was after back to back mistakes that he deliberately caused high danger shots in the slot by leaving his post to follow his D mate after the puck into the D mates corner. The world’s best player (and my future son in law) was sat at least 3 shifts through the year, that I can remember.

        All big stats and all micro stats show that each player on the team has substantially worse stats when playing with him. The only exception is Ruhweedel (note very very small sample size) who apparently is only marginally worse when playing with JJ. The big stat that sticks out in my mind (and I wish I still had the link to provide here) which came out at the end of the year was that at 5 on 5 the Pens XGF was 20% greater when JJ was NOT on the ice than when he WAS on the ice and the next closest player in the NHL for the next biggest negative interval XGF% (and having played at least 25 games) was less than negative 10%.

        You stated that he was a plus player for 5 of 7 months. He actually was only a plus player in Dec and Feb. That is only 2 of 7 months.

        I have sympathy regarding his being shifted from LD to RD and back again. However according to play by play broadcasters; after October his stats were not significantly different playing LD or RD.

        For the Isles series you had said that he was on the ice for only 3 goals. It was 4 and he was on the ice for a GF resulting in a minus 3 in 3 games played and was , as I said before, IMO directly responsible for 2 of the goals and tangentially/co-responsible for another. He had 3 penalties; two of which were absolutely bonehead unwarranted truly stupid ones; and all three came at points in the game when Pens were dominating…. Killing in effect more scoring opportunities. You had laid some blame on Shultz. Here I cannot side with you in any way. JJ was out of position so many times in that game that Shultz was often left to cover two defensive positions. So, sorry I disagree with you there.

        I’ve already admitted that I’m jaded and biased. I can’t deny that.

        Part of this is my experience when watching Pens games often with others.

        Here is a couple of strange/goofy anecdotes that will demonstrate my jaded (and skewed) opinion of JJ.

        Game two I’m watching with friends here in T.O. Two of my friends (twins) have been Islander fans from our late teens. Picture two giant mirror images only differentiated by one wearing a Bossy jersey while the other is wearing a Trottier jersey. For the entire game , every time Sully is shown on the screen they are chanting over and over “Play Jack more, Play Jack more”. Every mistake JJ made (and as I’ve said there were many) they are blowing kisses to JJ and thanking him profusely. Two 57 year old behemoths acting like they are 4. Note— no alcohol or drugs. Neither has ever imbibed at all ….. ever; and wait for it… both have their PHDs. Educated sober giants acting like 4 year olds giddy each time JJ steps on the ice; totally convinced that JJ will definitely be the difference maker in Isles winning the game.

        Now game three and I’m actually watching in Pittsburgh. People I don’t even know are whining and complaining EACH and EVERY shift JJ is on; yelling at the screen; pointing out each and every guffaw by JJ. They have the cruelty to (in loud voices) wish for him to be injured. This is NOT just a single person. This is many many at the bar and from many many different groups.

        I’m fairly sure my perceptions of JJ are shared by many.

        Again, I do not challenge the integrity of the man at all. He has all the skills (save for the ability to effectively move the puck out of his zone). He is just not a good player and it stems solely from his inability to read the play properly and consistently be out of position and for taking in appropriate and inopportune penalties.

        I wish the man no harm. I just wish, with all my being, that he is not going to play as a regular for the Pens. With that wish at heart, playing him minimally or having him sit for the full year is a waste of $3.25 M in Cap. Again, the absolute best solution, is for a buyout (now waiting for an Arb case between ZAR, Pettersson, Blueger for the window to open).

        A buyout might also work in JJ’s favour. He’ll lose $4.3M in the buyou0t but there will be another GM that will pick him up for $700 K for emergency use… 4 successive $700 K contracts at the worst and he is out only $1.5M. Add to that the change of scenery (and pressure) and perhaps his play improves beyond $700 K for 19/20 and he gets a 2 * $1M contract next year.

        Anything is possible.

        Again sorry for disagreeing.

        Off to a meeting now, I will try and check back in later.

        Pengy

  17. Kinda surprised the Lightning are trying to trade Dominigue. He played pretty good when he was in there. Was kinda surprising to see them sign another goalie.

  18. Theyre probably doing it to free up more $$$$ to try & sign Point.

    • they appear to really be scraping for $-
      I’m not 100% sure of spending that much on him-

  19. Perhaps Holland calls McCrimmon and offers PJ for Gusev straight up. Works for both sides cap and talent.

    To VGS: Pujujarvi
    To EDM: Gusev

    • Now that the ice has been broken, why not simply Offer Sheet Gusev? No one owes Vegas any favours and he could likely be had for a $3.5 mil offer, which Vegas would be hard-pressed to match, and cost practically nothing in terms of picks.

  20. The heavy money wielding power of the Montreal Canadiens is a prime example of how to effectively use the Offer Sheet.

    I say bienvenue à Montréal Sebastian Aho!

    It will be problematic and impossible/improbable for the Carolina Hurricanes to match.

    1st bonus instalment is payable 5 days after the pen to paper then the second will be July 1st 2020 Leo less than 1 year Aho will receive a bonus of $21MM plus his minimum salary. Thus becoming a problem because, if they look to trade him after the minimum 1 year allowed under the CBA, Carolina Hurricanes would have already paid half of the Bonus laden deal.

    If they keep him, they must pay the aforementioned scheduled bonuses on July 1st inclusive of his minimum salary of only $750k till the end of 5 years and Sebastian Aho will be an UFA afterwards.

    It’s brilliant.

    • I think the new Hurricanes owner has more money to spend then the previous regime so I don’t really see it being that big of a factor any longer.

    • My bad.. I’m stupefied!

      As per
      https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/hurricanes/salary

      Congratulations are in order to the Carolina Hurricanes organization.

      I will say that I didn’t see this come to a fruition so quickly.

    • I don’t think it was brilliant Antoni. BBB and I beat that horse to death yesterday, no point doing it again today, but Carolina was always going to match that offer. Dundon has deep pockets and cash isn’t an issue for him.

      So if you are a Habs fan, and if any out there read this, what grade would you give Bergevin for the deals he has made so far?

      My thoughts he cleared out cap space by trading Shaw for what I thought was nothing near his value when he didn’t have a cap problem. Now MTL has plenty of cap space.
      We will see but I see MTL worse, not better.
      So far at least, we will see from here.

    • LOL Bergevin please offer sheet Marner next…$9.3m you know somewhere in between what the player asked and what the team first offered.
      I love how the canes management laughed and thanked him for making the process easy. Gold.

      • Better gold was the poll on their account

        Will the canes match?

        Yes

        Oui

      • Agree that it is not a good look for Bergevin, but you would have to think that Carolina doesn’t front load that contract without the offer sheet. Why would they?
        I also think they wanted to by a some UFA years right now on a player like Aho as well.
        Would have all been part of the negotiating process, so I don’t think they were all that happy about this, but obviously did what they had to.
        From what was reported as of yesterday Aho was asking for 9.5, and Carolina was offering 7.5. They likely would have got to nearly the same # which is right in the middle. Just structured differently and perhaps for a little longer for a slightly higher number.
        Not ideal for Carolina in the short or long term.

      • The only flaw in the deal for Carolina is that, in matching the Habs offer, Aho now becomes a UFA at age 26! He keeps up what he’s been doing and that’s going to be a whopper of a contract come 2024

      • Yep George, Aho got what he wanted. A big fat check right away and 1 year, plus UFA at 26.
        He needs to buy his agent a beer, or 2.

  21. IF MTL loses out on AHo NYR have a left side defenseman in Staal and a steady Namestnikov to trade to you for a 2nd and 3rd rd pick.

    • IHC

      JJ for a 7th rounder in 2043… can’t do better than that right?

      • Pengy…..perhaps Alzner for JJ lol

  22. An Old Hockey Fan

    Re money question….
    Pengy says…………”huge disparity”
    Ron Moore says….”nice chunk of change but not life changer”

    I would say these two opinions are very different. What say you ???

    Please explain…Tampa Bay 5 mill gets you 3 mil take home….
    Tor. Montr Ott…5 mil gets you 2.2 mil take home…
    If true.. then Canadian teams may have some gifted athletes but few economics majors. Why sign in Canada ???
    Thanks for your attention and input….An Old Hockey Fan

    • Maybe one reason why Kawhi Leonard won’t re-up with the Raptors because now you’re talking BIG bucks.

      • George, Basketball on a hockey site?
        I don’t think he will sign in Toronto either, but the Raptors can pay him way more $$, plus the competition is to go to California which ain’t cheap on the tax side either.
        I read the other day, if Kawhi moves on from TO and doesn’t take the max deal only they can offer, he will have walked away from a total of $80M over the last couple contract offers (San Antonio and Toronto).
        I guess it ain’t about the money for Kawhi.
        No fuss or fanfare with this guy. Kind of awesome really.

  23. Duchene/Johansen/Turris/Bonino down the middle in Nashville…

  24. Carolina has matched. So Bergevin must find something else to do with his money. By my calculations, he has about $11.5m. available. Jake Gardner is still out there. So are a few decent forwards, Dzingel, Ferland Johanssen. He must get Gardiner and a forward. At this point, will likely cost no more than $10-10.5m. combined. When July 2 arrives, options and $ for UFAs drop. If he doesn’t at least try, he should be fired.

    • Bergevin should be making deals with the teams that need to shed salary asap. Get a player and a pick…

    • The canes had to match the kid is a surperstar, worth a try for Bergevin no harm no foul

      • No harm no foul? Ok, we’ll see.

      • Lol I thought you said nobody would sign in Montreal……but you didn’t realize aho had to sign lol stick to the none hockey comments you sound a little more intelligent 🤓 not that you will have any knowledge on this but jay feaster offer sheeted Ryan orielly and had no trouble making trades after with over a dozen gm’s lol but again that probably won’t compute will it

      • Jay Feaster isn’t the best example of smart moves by a GM. He didn’t realize that if Colorado didn’t match his offer sheet, then O’Reilly would have had to clear waivers first and anybody could have snatched him up before Calgary due to O’Reilly playing a couple games in the KHL after the lockout shortened NHL season began.
        Not a good look.

      • That’s one reason why Feaster wound up on his keister 🙂

      • That’s not the point ray no gm’s stopped trading with him because he made an offer sheet go check out the trades

      • We disagree on this BBB, which is fine. Perhaps I am not explaining my point of view on how the other GM’s will impact dealing with Bergevin moving forward.
        The vast majority of business to business dealing are based on relationships, always have been and will continue to be.
        If Bergevin had a better relationship with Waddell and Carolina maybe he extracts useful information regarding ownership’s willingness to match an offer sheet, or unwillingness to let and offer like that bully them into letting MTL have their best young player for what amounts to negatively impacting cash flow.
        Maybe if Bergevin was able to form a better relationship with Duchene and his agent he would have realized what really mattered to Duchene and that MTL would not be able to give him what he was really looking for without overpaying substantially.
        Clearing out a valuable player like Shaw for a pittance without having the proper information, which you get with strong relationships that allows you to have open and honest communication, was an avoidable mistake.
        Will this offer sheet help Bergevin build the type of relationships so that this doesn’t happen again? I can’t see how it helps as those relationships are based on earned respect and trust. I would think a fellow GM is shaking his head wondering WTF he is doing, and will he do it to me. Is he quizzing me just so he can F**K me over?
        Maybe Bergevin wasn’t capable of accomplishing that before, as it appears he made decisions without proper information. So maybe you are right, nothing changes.
        This definitely ain’t gonna help.
        Sorry if this sounds like a speech I make to my sales people and sales managers, but I think it’s true.

      • Yes we definitely disagree and Shaw wasn’t a dump look at the very bottom of the page for why

  25. Who has signed in Montreal? Who would want to? Aho signed an offer sheet to help HIS cause. He could careless who the offer sheet came from. It all works in his favour. Exactly what does he get out of it? Keep your insults to yourself keyboard tough guy.

    • No, Aho wanted to be in Montreal.

      • Aho hasn’t come out and said that yet. His agent did. Not a reliable source. There were few teams that had the cap space and pockets to pull that off. So Montreal could have easily been the only option for aho to use to make the canes s**t or get off the pot. It’s speculative either way.

    • The only insult is trying to talk hockey! Why do you even comment on here? You make comments about women getting gang raped like it’s ok, get a life dude

      • * trying to talk hockey with you

      • MB made some bonehead moves this past week, he seemed to be getting the habs back on track the last few months but, I’m afraid all that has gone to S#/+$. He is making it clear someone other than himself should be Gm’n montreal. Shea must be asking Marc for a drug test. Then again, maybe Carolina messes this up.

      • lol I’m sure you think dubas should still be there after giving away a 1st and the whole nylander fiasco? But ya Bergevin should go because he made an offer sheet and cleared cap space without having to give up anything makes a whole lot of sense lol

  26. *What does MB get out of it?

  27. Bergevin’s best move is NOT to sign Gardiner & Dzingel BUT rather call up cap strapped teams like Vegas, Tampa, and others and see what is available. Take a player or 2 or 3 for the 1 yr or 2 yrs left along with picks or good prospects to build more depth in their organization.

    Those assets can always be flipped for better.
    Tampa needs some significant space. NSH wants to get rid of Turris. Vegas needs space so is Stastny (2yrs only) available along with Gusev for something.

    Use the cap wisely for short term till another better option comes along.

    Gardiner at $7 million will be another Alzner type contract.

    Be prudent GM MB . Don’t overpay for less talent. After your AHO move….fans will be ok leaving Gardiner and Dzingel off the team.

    • Well, if teams like the Habs don’t overpay for Gardiner, Toronto may figure out how to keep him. That would be good imo but I still think he ends up in Montreal.

      • Don’t Gardiner’s back problems scare you a little bit BCLeafFan?
        I would want my team doctors checking him out before I fork over a long term deal.
        Even then you just never know with back problems.
        I like Gardiner and think he got more criticism than he deserved, but this seems like buyer beware to me. Which might explain why no one has signed the best (arguably) UFA D man available.
        Perhaps a team gets him late when he is completely healed and rehabbed.

      • They may not have room as now it appears the ‘Canes are INTENDING to match….perhaps to pull more assets from MTL.

        I’d give up Domi & Drouin for AHO in a second. LOL

      • He doesn’t want to go there (as far as i heard), but also i have no idea where he would like to play

      • IHC remember the chris gratton offer sheet? Philly offer sheeted gratton in 97 Tb didn’t match but already had trades of the first rounders back to philly I think renberg and dykhuis were involved it was a mess lol

      • @BBB LOL yup.

        Completely remember that team run by Esposito. What a joke. I was not as knowledgeable as I am today but when I saw they got Renberg and Dykhuis I laughed. I never saw Gratton as “going to be great” so I would have taken all the draft picks LOL . Guess I was right.

      • IHC ya none of those players would be worth a single 1st nowadays lol

  28. Pengy…perhaps you call up GM MB and offer up JJ for Karl Alzner. LOL

    benefits both sides.

  29. I think everyone on this site is actually a leaf fan. Everyone loves to talk about what they should and shouldn’t do. That only comes from a fan that truly cares about their team.

    • The Who?

    • Hi Vinnie!
      Full disclosure?
      I hate the Leafs kinda like the hate a fisherman has for net wrecking, fish eating seals. It’s a pure and honest hate.
      I do admire the balls on Dubas though.
      There’s at least 17 leafs I’d trade out before Kadri.
      I figured he’d ship out another winger.
      I also thought the deal from Treliving was better.
      Kadri got a swing in on the way out the door, at least.

  30. Laine gets offer sheet from who??

    Who do ya think? Who has the space & picks?

    OTT? NYI? NYR? NJ? AZ?

    Would WPG take
    Kreider, Namestnikov & 2 1sts for Laine?

    to create

    Panarin/Zib/Buch
    Laine/Chytl or Kratsov/Kakko
    Chtyl or Kratsov/Lias/Strome
    Lemieux/Howden/Fast

    • Montreal!! Lol Bergevin will never make a trade again in the eyes of ray and fd so he better offer laine or Connor lol

      • lol

        I think he’d look good on the opposite wing of Kako….maybe even Lias in the center.

      • Never said he wouldn’t ever be able to make a trade BBB. Show me where I did.
        I said it would impact his ability to deal with other GM’s.
        Would you trust a guy who talks to you about a player and the offer sheets you?
        I wouldn’t tell him anything that mattered, and if anything I would BS him as you now can’t trust him.
        Other GM’s saw what just happened.
        Will they trade with him? Sure, but if it is about any player like an Aho again? I don’t tell MB anything that of real importance.

      • What I say?

      • Ray I don’t think you have a clue what you’re talking about to be honest, I bet it doesn’t change a thing except maybe with Waddell, gm’s that want to win will deal every gm to make their team better regardless of an offer sheet! If not 5hey shouldn’t be a gm

  31. If Gardner is really smart he gives us $1 for more term. Take a $6m for 7 instead of more for less term.

    Get that front loaded too. This way your bout out is cheaper if your back caves you got paid already and the buyout is cheaper.

  32. The only issue I have with the whole offer sheet thing is go big or go home. Give them compensation that matches 4 firsts.
    You could get one back with a trade for other players. Kinda second related deal. That takes some of the sting out of it.

    • Ya on the surface SilverSeven, but we are seeing why offer sheets are rare.
      Either overpay so they don’t match and put yourself in cap hell, or they match.
      Neither out come is good.
      The tell was when MB said “this shows our fans that we are trying to win”
      He dumped the salary of Shaw for a 2nd. Total steal for Chicago, so that he could try and get Duchene.
      Swing and a miss and a bad uniformed decision.
      Tries to save face by crapping in Carolina’s sandwich.
      Not the definition of savvy, and frankly unprofessional IMO.

      • Montreal got a 2nd,3rd and 6th and gave up 2 2nds, Shaw is one hit away from major problems! How is that a steal? He missed a pile of games in Montreal

      • It was Shaw and a 7th for a 2nd, 3rd and 7th.
        So a 2nd and rd for shaw.
        Mid 2nd round picks a crap shoot to even be NHL players. 3rd’s even less.
        63 games – 19G – 28A – 47 pts. +17. and a physical player.
        A salary dump.

      • Ya and they gave up 2 2nds 3 yrs ago! So good return for the Habs especially how worn down Shaw is Chicago will regret this

  33. I’d like to see Lias Andersson for Gusev trade straight up.

  34. Reilly/Ristolainen
    Muzzin/Barrie
    Dermott/Ceci (Gudas)

    TO needs to trade Nylander for Ristolainen + 2nd. Ristolainen is the perfect D man that TO needs. I really want Gudas as he is also what TO needs in the back end to balance out the D core.

    Hyman/Tavares/Marner…..200+pts
    Johnnson/Matthews/Kapanen180pts
    Moore/Kerfoot/Bracco…..120+pts
    Timoshov/Mueller/Spezza…120+pts

    Trade Guathier for Maroon, Reaves, Carrier, Ferland or Martin. Any one of those guys to rotate into lineup depending who we play against each night. No more slow And soft Hainsey, no more afraid to get hit Gardner, no more hesitant Zaitsev.

    Just hope Bobcock won’t screw up this year. If he can’t get to the conference finals against Tampa in 2020, he needs to go.