Is a summer trade coming for the Tampa Bay Lightning? What’s the latest on Kevin Shattenkirk? Find out in today’s NHL rumor mill.
LIGHTNING
Could the Lightning shop Valtteri Filppula in a cost-cutting deal this summer?
TAMPA BAY TIMES: Joe Smith reports the Lightning’s re-signing of winger Alex Killorn yesterday to a seven-year deal worth $4.45 million leaves them only $8.5 million of salary-cap space for 2016-17. That could make it tricky to re-sign remaining restricted free agents Nikita Kucherov, Vladislav Namestnikov and Nikita Nesterov. Smith speculates Kucherov is due a significant raise potentially as high as $6 million per season. Killorn’s new contract will also affect efforts to re-sign RFAs Tyler Johnson, Jonathan Drouin and Ondrej Palat next summer.
To get under the cap this summer, GM Steve Yzerman said he’ll likely have to make a trade this summer. Smith suggests center Valtteri Filppula ($5 million cap hit), defenseman Jason Garrison ($4.6 million cap hit) and goaltender Ben Bishop ($5.9 million cap hit, also an unrestricted free agent next summer) as possible trade candidates. Regarding his goalie situation, Yzerman said things are quiet right now, adding his club is more than happy to start next season with Bishop and Andrei Vasilevskiy.
SPECTOR’S NOTE: Of the three, Filppula could be the easiest to move, as he has a partial no-trade clause, while Garrison has a full no-trade clause and Bishop a full no-movement. Garrison, however, did waive his clause to go from Vancouver to Tampa Bay, but will he be willing to do so again? While Bishop is a Vezina Trophy finalist, there’s not much of a market for him right now. The Dallas Stars were rumored to be interested, but they have to shed either Kari Lehtonen or Antti Niemi and that won’t be easy because of their contracts. Perhap a Bishop trade takes place during training camp and preseason, when the market could improve as clubs assess their goaltending.
SHATTENKIRK
YAHOO SPORTS: Greg Wyshynski notes defenseman Kevin Shattenkirk remains with the St. Louis Blues, despite weeks of trade speculation. He cites St. Louis Post-Dispatch’s Jeremy Rutherford reporting St. Louis Blues GM Doug Armstrong is still looking for a return that “makes sense” for the team. There’s a sense from Armstrong that Shattenkirk could start next season with the Blues. Wyshynski lists the lack of urgency on Armstrong’s part to swing a deal and Shattenkirk’s UFA status next summer as significant factors affecting the blueliner’s trade status.
EDMONTON JOURNAL: David Staples believes Shattenkirk’s trade value is dropping, in part because the Blues can’t get what they want and because of Shattenkirk’s “mediocre-to-ok” performance in the 2016 playoffs. As the new season gets closer, he’ll start to become more of a rental player. There’s also repeated reports claiming Shattenkirk only wanted to sign with an Eastern Conference team. Staples would prefer the Oilers prefer Colorado’s Tyson Barrie, considering him “a more effective and dynamic attacker than Shattenkirk”, as well as having “more bite” to his defensive game.
SPECTOR’S NOTE: A Shattenkirk trade is still possible, but it might not happen until training camp and preseason at the earliest. Otherwise, Armstrong does seem comfortable starting next season with Shattenkirk and waiting for the right deal to come along before the Feb. 28 trade deadline.
I don’t see too many teams lining up to take Valtteri Filppula in a trade. I always thought TB badly over-rated the guy when they gave him that 5 year $25 mil deal – 145 goals in 716 games played is NOT what anyone should be paying for a “soft” LW.
Even if there was a trade out there for some of these guys with the salary that would likely have to go back to Tampa to make a deal work I think by looking at the numbers it would need to be a more significant deal than just 1 player (buy out perhaps?) to squeeze all the RFAs under that cap now
Buy out for at least one of them seems to make the most sense to me as well.
Im not sure 1 questionable trade necessarily “establishes a market” any more than Benning established the market when he traded Bieksa. It was a bad trade, Seguin is a top line center the market for top line centers was not really effected by the Bruins getting fleeced by Nill. People keep saying to get a D like Larsson its gonna cost a guy like Hall make no sense….how many players like Hall are in the game top 4 or 5 at his postion? So to get a decent but not great D its going to take one of the top players in the game? Its not the market, its a bad trade made out 8f desperation.
Sorry meant for Dan ?
Good point Shticky, we’ll have to watch and see how things develop in the market for Dman. As a Leaf fan, I hope it softens up considerably.
While the front end of my team has the potential to be there or thereabouts and potentially the golatending, too, I just don’t see it from the D. The Leafs need an elite defender and I don’t know where that is coming from.
Here’s where I see the team down the line – I show some of the prospects who may pan out as well, but exclude the 2016 picks Matthews, Korshkov aside.
LW – JVR, Shosh, Komi, Martin, Lindberg, Jonson, Timashov
C – Matthews, Kadri, Hyman (or RW), Gauthier, Froese
RW – Nylander, Marner, Brown, Kapanen, Rychel, Korshkov
LD – Rielly, Gardiner, Loov, Valiev
RD – TBD #1 D, Zaitsev, Carrick, Neilsen, Corrado
G – Andersen, TBD
What you could conclude from the Larson/hall trade is it may take one of your top 3 forwards to get a top 4 D.
He’s a center
Again look at some other D thats moved Kulikov Gubranson Gologoski…none of these guys are exactly in the same boat as Larsson I know but the cost is nowhere near Hall its not the market its a desperate trade
Edm probably should have gotten more back but with the fin falling to them at four and the lucic signing it might work out for the best
I assume Chiarelli explored any & all options. He’s been trying to address this issue for over a year. Finally took the deal he could get done.
Most of you will be eating crow in 2 years.
Hall is 1 year older than Larsson in 2 years will still only be 26 and still likely one of if not the best at his position…I’m not sure we will be saying the same about Larsson. It may not look as bad a couple years down the road, I’ll give you that but I don’t see much crow being eaten in my crystal ball perhaps yours has better reception?
Time will tell.
Hall is a great hockey player. 1 of the bsst LW’s in the game a stud.
I think part of the Hall trade had to do with giving McJesus the C. Don’t think you could have if Hall is still there.
Shticky,
As an Oiler fan, I agree with you that Edmonton should have got more for Hall. But I don’t think that would have been possible. For too long, Edmonton has been the running joke of the NHL. Fans are fed up with management and how the team is going. Other GM’s know that Chiarelli is in a no win situation. Oilers have plenty of forwards are is in desperate need of a D. They know they can rip off the Oilers and why wouldn’t they take advantage of that? I’m sure that Chiarelli would of got a lot better trade if his team wasn’t named the Edmonton Oilers.
A the end of the day, if the trade pans out and Oilers are in the playoffs next year (or still contending for a spot by March) with Larsson playing up to expectations, then Chiarelli will look like a genius.
George Brassard to Ottawa For Zenablad and a 2nd. Whadda think
Why?
i AGREE TOO WHY? DERICK bRASSARD PRETTY DAMN GOOD….
If Larsson cost Hall then what are they trading for Barrie or Shattenkirk? I don’t see Eberle or RNH netting either. Don’t quite understand why these EDM beat writers are still in delusion, immediately after a monumental trade established the market.
I don’t really feel that trade established the market.
Seems a bit like Chiarelli hit his panic button a bit to soon.
I’m not saying RNH and Eberle is enough for Shattenkirk. I just feel like they could of got him for Hall instead.
It’s shocking, Insomnia.
Barrie is not signed & Shattenkirk don’t have a contract past the upcoming season. this is why they will not get a return like Larsson,signed for 5 more years I think. Not saying it was a great trade but hey STL fans didn’t like the Shanahan for up and coming Defensemen Pronger trade back in the day, that turned out pretty good. lol a bit of wishful thinking but hey if the leafs fans can so can I. Haha
chiarelli did not hit any panic button…. Edmonton oiler fans are in denial thats all this is……
Oiler fans just dont want to admit that many of their players arent worth what they think they are…The Oilers were a laughingstock, the biggest joke in hockey for 10 years.
Only oiler fans could possibly believe that players could be part of that situation and not suffer any consequences. its just a fact guts like Hall, RNH, Eberle,and Yak are tarnished and will continue to be until the team actually improves.
it is what it is Oiler fans may not like it but they are in denial….Chiarelli did what he had to do….unlike some oiler fans, chiarelli deals with reality
Chiarelli, didn’t set the trade market he gave into a request. Shticky hit it spot on with the Seguin comparison. Funny how its the same guy who didn’t get close to equal value for Seguin or Hall. There is a trend here, and it belongs to the GM of the Oilers
You’re right Caper, can’t draw a trend line with only one data point. I thought Chia was going to hold out for a reasonable deal when I heard him speak at the draft. Turns out, not for long.
@caper your right one trade doesn’t set the market when kessel was moved for nothing to Pitts goal scorers weren’t getting moved for nothing. Imo larsson is better than ppl give him credit for
@Bigbadbruins – You can change your name, but your trolling gives you away. Sad that your only contribution here is to try and incite a juvenile tit for tat re people’s favorite teams, which only serves to clog up the forum and choke out legitimate hockey discussion. Is your entire life filled with these petty battles? I feel sorry for you.
It was an example what is wrong with that? Ppl r bashing PC pretty bad and neither player has played a game with the new team? You don’t see oilers fans getting all mad calling leaf fans trolling when they Bash the hall trade do you?
Dan
remember someone on here used to cut up the Kessel trade daily ? Throw out the name Kapanen and see what happens !
This is how much of a hypocrite dan39 is shticky brought up how Nill ” fleeced Boston ” in the segin trade and it was a great point but when the kessel to Pitts deal is brought up as an example like the seguin trade it’s trolling?
@Bigbadbruins
The hypocrisy does run rampant here doesn’t it. It’s ok for the ones who live their lives in this forum to carve, but not for others.
@Bigbadbruin, you brought it up to try and incite a petty battle – it’s your old modus operandi, now under a new name. It’s trolling, plain and simple. Cut out the childish behaviour and you won’t get shamed into changing your name every three months.
You are delusional Dan? Please don’t reply to my posts with your petty insults. Thank you
As far as the Kessel deal in parts Kessel being moved with some spare parts is responsible for Anderson Kapanen Rychel James Greenway a 2017 2nd a 2018 2nd and nearly 7 mill in cap space…it’s a pretty sweet deal
@shticky so your saying don’t judge the trade right away and it could turn out good?
@BBB I don’t disagree with you, but as Chad has a couple of time posted Chiarelli trade history it isn’t very flattering. The thing about the market trend is that it always changes. Some times one GM will make a move, that other won’t. Example as of date St.Louis are not getting what they want for Shattenkirk, will they I don’t know but at the moment those in need are saying no. Different circumstances I know; but people thought the market was set last year when Boston got a bounty for Lucic who had 1yr left on his contract. Takes two to make a deal, just depends on how much you really need to deal.
@caper imo larsson is just coming into is own and under contract for 4-5 yrs can’t remember I agree the seguin trade and not resigning erikkson or getting anything in return hurt. I imo this trade won’t be as one sided as everyone thinks
shticky, I’m sorry but youre WRONG… simply and inequivcably wrong and you and oiler fans have no leg to stand on….
Halls value was Larsson period not more, or he simply would have gotten more. he didn’t. and if Snow is to be believed, he turned down Hall for Hamonic as well…. As such Hall’s value has been determined…
you can say he should have gotten more but youd be In denail too. in fact you are……
Hall’s value has been determined, and it wasn’t what you thought it was, or what you apparently STILL think it is. that is refusing to accept reality……as such you are in denial…
nothing you say can change that
I agree with both you and schticky dan. I believe the hall trade DID set the market as gm’s can point to that trade and say “see.” But I dont think it will permanently remain that way for the season. It could very well be why movement has stopped regarding top 4 d-men.
The market was essentially already set. These quality of Dman rarely if ever movem yes chiarelli was desperate. Edm has been trying to find a top pairing dman since they lost Pronger.
Chiarelli did what he had to do. Edm is far better served.
@striker I totally agree edm did what they had to do
@striker. I disagree. One of the top wingers in the game for a potential top 2 (not proven yet) raised the bar a bit. GMs probably waiting each other out.
What top 2 Dman have moved in the last decade?
18th for hits, 27th for blocked shots, 44th for TOI/GP for all NHL Dman in the NHL last season & just turned 23 in Nov. Played as NJ’s #2 last season, 0:27 less per game than Greene. Was easily NJ’s best Dman last year.
Just scratching the surface of his potential & the only time he’s ever been deployed offensively was in his rookie year. He’ss been utilized solely in a shut down role & he can play against the best players in the NHL.
An opposing young man at 6’3″ 205 lbs & still filling out his massive frame. This is untapped offensive skills there. He scored in Jr Europe & twice at the WJC’s. He made the highest level he could pkay at as a 15 year old. Like making major Jr. At the same age in North America virtually unheard of especially for a Dman.
This is a way better player than most of you semm to recognise. Factor in he’s signed for 5 years at 4.167 & that’s very good value. & in todays NHL cash is king.
Ya know who else hits and blocks a lot of shots while playing a tone of minutes…Dion Phaneuf Johnny Oduya Johnny Boychuck 3 guys all traded kinda recently that did not cost Taylor Hall…
No top 2 I can think of… Including Larsson. Hence market setting. At least for now
Weren’t those 3 pretty much salary dumps tho? Maybe not the right ones but the cap had its hand in Boston and Chicago for sure Phaneuf was just overpaid
My point BBB is Larsson is not worth Hall no matter how you try and polish it up. NJ D is not good so by showing that he played the most minutes. On a team with terrible D and therefore led the team in hits and the puck hitting him? Some how gives credence to his value being anywhere near Taylor Hall is almost moronic Kris Russell blocks lots of shots how’s his value right now? Wasn’t Griffen Rienhart that young shut down stud D the Oilers were looking for? It’s a desperate move that you probably could argue is warranted but it was an over payment and desperate none the less
Boychuk wasn’t a top 2 when moved, still isn’t, NYI’s #3 & he was a cap casulty given away for nothing, Oduya was a #4; still is, & he doesn’t hit unless you consider 73 hits less than 1 a game hitting. Phaneuf certainly hits but doesn’t bloch shots at a high rate, 89, Larson had 148. Weren’t you 1 of the Phaneufs a #4 D at best. Also a salary casualty.
Larsson is already a better defensive Dman than either Phaneuf or Oduya & is at least as good as Boychuk now, he played more minutes in a higher role than Boychuk, had more hits & more blocked shots yet isn’t fully developed like Boychuk & makes almost 2 million less per season.
It wasn’t an over payment it was simply the cost. Has it set the market, no. The market was already set. These assets never move unless there is an under lying issue.
The cost is extreme. No way Chiarelli can win this trade 1 for 1 based on offensive stats. Hall wins every time but in Larsson Edm got a great young Dman that is a solid #2 defensivedman now may have more offense to give but he can play top pairing minutes against the leagues best players.
The deal saved 2 mil in cap space & allowed for the signing of Lucic. Edm is a way better team today having traded Hall for Larson & signing Lucuc.
I feel bad for Hall, he went from 1 aweful situation to another. Who hell wants to play in NJ. Now they have the worst D in the NHL. Thank god for Schneider but with out Larsson in front of him his #’s are taking a hit. NJ’s goal differntal wasn’t good last year. It’s going up by at least 20 next year.
I’d argue its a wash for edm now with lucic and larsson and in a couple years lucics deal will likely resemble hartnell, nash, bickell…. ok maybe the last on a stretch. highly overpaid powerforward who tend to diminish quick into their thirties. Larsson was a top pairing d amn competing against the likes of greene, severson, shlemko, etc. slappin a new paint job on him and a new car airfreshener doesnt make him a top pairing guy. that being the case the market for middlepairing guys with top pairing potential is a top line forward… until somebody does something to reset the market.
@chris I disagree about lucic after the family tragedy he could have went the wrong way but he has looked like a better person with more drive I think he will be good for awhile on that contract
the style lucic plays isnt conducive to longevity. How many players playing his style remains top 6 players into their mid thirties? not too many. odds are that contract being viewed as an albatross before halfway finished.
Larsson would not be a top 2 on a lot of teams Striker that’s kinda the point yes he was in NJ on a blue line that’s been paper thin for years. You can’t tell me if he was playing on a whole bunch of teams he is going to play those mins or this situations he was in Jersey so to say look at all the shots he blocked! Is a rather meaningless piece of info. Does that make him good or just mean NJ couldn’t get the puck out of their end?
striker dont waste your breath oiler fans in general are in total denial they are grasping at straws because they refuse to admit the truth
they refuse to acknowledge that Snow turned down Hamonic for Hall…. so Hall’s value was what it was. Players with a losing aura and me first attitude, just dont have the value some think…Vanek is another example of this
Not to knock ya off your soap box Bill, but I’m not an Oiler fan and I’d say the majority of fans from a lot of different teams would say this trade stinks and Taylor Hall is a better talent than Larsson
Shticky as I have said many times already. 1 for 1 Edm loses this trade now today but it makes Edm a better team & we don’t know yet what Larsson is no where near fully developed.
He didn’t play for another team he played for NJ & was their best Dman. What or where he would fit on another teams depth chart is irrelevant & meaningless.
It wasn’t an over payment it was simply the cost. These assets are expensive that’s why they virtually never move. People can’t stomach the cost.
What makes the Oilers better s McDavid for a full year and a year older same with Nurse Klefbolm Daisaitil compatent coaching….so many other things that are not this trade lol but go ahead wait until they are a little better than shoot off about how this trade saved them And you knew it all along…lol
shticky, I’m sorry but youre WRONG… simply and inequivcably wrong and you and oiler fans have no leg to stand on….
Halls value was Larsson period not more, or he simply would have gotten more. he didn’t. and if Snow is to be believed, he turned down Hall for Hamonic as well…. As such Hall’s value has been determined…
you can say he should have gotten more but youd be In denail too. in fact you are……
Hall’s value has been determined, and it wasn’t what you thought it was, or what you apparently STILL think it is. that is refusing to accept reality……as such you are in denial…
nothing you say can change that
Ya sound loonie bill. Most would say don’t make a bad trade just for the sake of making a trade this is one of those times imo easy to slag on the Oilers but it doesn’t mean a good player on a bad team has less value it’s a bad trade and that’s my opinion . You screaming about how wrong I am and Garth Snow and drawing any conclusions on value from that (Snow stated several times he wanted a comparable D Hall is a winger hintty hint hint) is looney
If you’re going to take RNH or Eberle at 6 mil why not just resign Shattenkirk ?
Exactly
My understanding of the cba is that Garrison’s NMC he signed with Vancouver doesn’t follow him to TB. Am I wrong here?
That’s what I thought too
Bishop leaving looks like the best long term solution and they could try and lock in Kucherov and ask the others to wait for more than one year pitance deals.Th elightning got lucky that their guys want to stay together and win together and have been ever so reasonable…I wonder if Kucherov will be also? If he was in that category, you would think they would have locked him up quickly also…I love that the rest of the league has now gotten to the CAP levels of no return that has been the issue after Cup championship one in Chicago, with so many player losses.
I am pretty sure the GMs will be asking their owners to amend things now that the looney has flatten the idea of an ever-rising CAP to problematic arithmetic problem for the GMs.
Yep, they already need another lockout. Something closer to the NBA model of shorter term deals and max contracts for star players would make sense.
It’s coming. To many teams still losing way to much money. The top 4 teams in the league account for almost 70% of the revenue.
The players share of league revenue needs to be reduced & the have teams need to share more of the wealth.
Nobody needs another lockout. The greedy scumbag owners WANT another lockout to save them from themselves as always. None of the previous lockouts got the owners what they wanted which is to break the union.
No it’s not. The game would be a mess with out 1 negotiating body. Owners don’t want to break the Union It’s to have a business plan in place to allow the game to grow which it has significantly & allow all teams to make money which there not.
TB went to thethe cup in 2014-15 averaged over 19k per game & still lost 1.4 mil in operating revenue. That’s not good business model.
There is enough greed to go around for everyone. Owners, players, agents etc.
I am a little surprised by the Killorn signing. Yzerman seems to be able to get everyone under contract, Stamkos, Callahan, Hedman etc. but in this NHL you need to know who you have to let go as well. You simply can’t have a core of 10 veterans on your team. Eventually someone would have demands you can’t fulfill. Stevie Y better hope that the person they can’t afford isn’t Kucherov and to a lesser degree Johnson, Palat and Namestikov.
Yzerman can only resign for richer contracts to a point. In the end he will be pressed against the cap and one or two of his current core will have to be traded. It’s inevitable under a cap system. Tampa will be competitive for many years before they’ll be somewhat bare like Chicago Blackhawks.
Chicago is a great example that’s the way I also see it happening
exactly, not sure why he signed Killorn. I’d rather keep the flexibility to ensure I sign the 4 guys I mentioned in my earlier post. Not a great situational signing in my opinion
Seems like to much money for a guy that can’t score 20 goals & barely can hit 40 points. Love his game & character but when a soft 2nd line ideally 3rd line LW gets this much money & term it speaks to what’s wrong with the business model.
Success in the playoffs is very costly to a teams payroll.
I have said it on here before, and I am a Leafs fan, the Oilers need to obtain defencemen. The suggestion that Shattenkirk’s trade value is dropping should only encourage the Oilers to send RNH the other way for him despite the short contract. Lucic signed there because of the McDavid factor. As for the Hall for Larsson robbery part of that deal is the signing of Lucic. Larsson will be a great defenceman as they take longer to mature. Craig Button said it best that the current formula in Edmonton was not working! Keeping Eberle makes sense due to his chemistry with McDavid. If you get Shattenkirk for RNH you need to think of it this way: Hall and RNH for Lucic, Larsson, and Shattenkirk. I would swing that deal any day! And for good measure sign Russel. If you were an Oiler fan would you like to start the year with Nurse, Larsson, Russell, and Shattenkirk on the blueline? I would! Oh yeah, and who’s Puljuljarvi? I may be a Leafs fan but I am extremely interested in seeing how the Oilers do with McDavid and good management like Charielli. I am looking forward to the Oilers and Leafs in the finals in a few years! Then Bettman will understand the value of the Canadian market. Don’t even get me started on the fairness of the first three years of the Subban for Weber deal!
@steven good post
Bruins will sign Barrie!!!
@rick w murray…..thats what you said last week and the week before
Getting rid of Bishop’s contract is going to cost them Drouin in the package where ever they send him. Start looking at the little teams with capspace and there’s your answer. As Lyle pointed out not many are gonna touch that Filpula contract.
Never. They’d let Bishop walk as a UFA before sacrifing Drouin.
Untrue Yankeee fan., because there are teams that can use him and feel they are btter off as he is closer to worththe money than the overpays for the guys they have around.
And you know what?
They may really feel that Bishop doesn’t have to leave until he actually helps be being healthy for one last Cup run…they are not trading the kid they have a very good #3 and will EVENTUALLY hand the reigns to the both of them…but maybe they still feel Bishops stays until the off season and draft in Chicago in 2016…or even let Las Vegas have him.
They HAVE to sign Kucherov but he’s a RFA and so are the other two Russians, so unless some team breaks the GM code of honor and sends a big fat sheet Kucherovs way, he has little to do about it
My point is Bill that TB is not going to include Drouin in any Bishop deal to make it so Bishop can be moved.
No, I don’t believe you’re right here. There is little risk in Bishops contract (other than him leaving) because of it transpiring. Bishop will fetch something back for sure. If there’s some sort of agreement between player and GM that he’d resign before UFA, he’d be worth even more in a trade scenario. Both Dallas and Calgary would be super interested in Bishop IMO. Their eventual interest and willingness to give in a trade would probably have to do with Bishops willingness to resign there.
Calgary already so no thanks to Bishop and from what I have read it had more to do with what he is looking at for his next contract.
as a Rangers fan, I’m liking the fact that Tampa, now with the 3 signings, hedman,stamkos, killorn..will soon be in cap trouble.
on the other hand you’ll have to deal with hedman and Stamkos for another 6-8 years
im sure the rest of the league is shaking in their boots having to go up against these two…
Brassard to the sens for Zibanejad. Didn’t see that coming
Maybe Dorion got cold feet when he heard from the agent what it would take to resign Zibanejad as a RFA. Or maybe he’s just stupid.
come ON – Zibanejad has had his chances to show consistency – and never has.
AND this gives the Sens cost certainty. Your patent anti-Sens is showing – so I have to consider the source.
Z is perfectly able. I can’t see how Brassard alone would change their fortunes. Sideways move, at best.
I don’t like that move for Ottawa. Given a choice of Brassard or Zibanejad I thake Zibanejad. Just on the cusp of breaking out. Would have still been 1 year away in Ottawa. Nyr wins this deal on player alone & they get a 2nd & save over 2 mil in salary this year.
What is Dorion doing!
Mika is pretty inconsistent and could go either way in the future the sens know what they are getting in brassard
Exactly. It’s two-way consistency for potential and I’ll take established consistency EVERY time.
george is right, zbinejad has a history of never showing up in shape and is very inconsistent and has a reputation of not meshing with his linemates very well.
people who aren’t aware of his really cant accurately evaluate this trade properly…..many are showing their ignorance here
Some of it is latent anti-Sens baloney emerging – much like some of the positive moves by the Leafs have generated latent anti-Leafs rhetoric from some Sens fans. Ultimately, both are as useless as teats on a bull and nothing of substance to any discussion.
a 23 year old and a 2nd round on a friendly contract for a 28 year old and big contract and a 7th round.
Dorion pulling plays out of the Jim Benning playbook. Give him another 2nd round pick why don’t you. Don’t stop at 1.
If looking at GMs track records, the first GM stint is almost always full of mistakes. I would target the hell out of Dorion, Benning and the likes when trading if I was GM.
He ain’t ancient – and 18, 19 and 27 goals in the past 3 seasons shows progress in that regard. They can afford the contract.
George, I don’t think the Sens got the short end of the deal at all. The last 3 years Brassard has put up 45 points (as a 3rd line center) 60, and 58 points as a 1a-1b center.
After seeing people here complain about Klein being overpaid, Stepan being overpaid etc….. I think I won’t even try to argue why a 50-60 point guy is not overpaid at 5 per…… But I’m sure it’s going to be all over here!
We’ll see if Brassard returns to a 36-47 points plateau (CBJ) or a 45-60 point plateau (NYR). Time will tell.
That’s profound! You can say that about ANY trade.
When Brassard was traded to NY I wasn’t very excited. Over the last 3 years I’ve watched him blossom into much more than I thought he was going to be. I seriously doubt he will regress to that point of his career, where he played on a god awful team.
Brassard’s role stays the same. Goes from a 1a, 1b sitution to the same. Nothing should change. Should be essentially the same player.
For a team with an internal cap why is Ottawa taking on salary. Is this going to make it any easier to give Hoffman & Ceci the money they deserve?
The main thing with the trade is Ottawa giving up a 2nd. Brassard is better today, but not that much better.
I’m a Sens fan and a friend of mine said he heard that Zibanejad wanted a trade to New York because his girlfriend is moving there. The 2nd was compensation for the Rangers paying the $2M signing bonus. Given Brassard is now only costing Ottawa $9.5M over the next 3 years for a good 2C, it’s very good cost certainty.
Whether that story is true, who knows. My friend knows a couple Sens players quite well, so it likely isn’t completely fabricated.
Forget that “internal cap” crap. Melnyk said he would spend if the right deals were there. An added intangible is, Brassard is from Gatineau, same as Pageau. With those two and guys waiting in the wings like Chabot, Gagne, Perron along with a French-Canadian GM and coach they are becoming more the “flying Frenchmen” than the Habs! That won’t hurt the fan interest on the Quebec side of the Ottawa River.
Nice work Van. I hadn’t looked up the contract. I should have before commenting. May hit the cap at 5 but Ottawa only incures 3 this year & 3.5 in each of the following 2.
Makes sense now & as you said that savings justifys Ottawa including the 2nd. Brassard will cost them less over the next 3 years than Zibanejad would have.
The business side of hockey coming into play yet again.
I take it back George I like the deal for Ottawa. I think Zibanejad will be a better player than Brassard eventually almost the same players today but Zibanejad won’t be fully developed for over another year.
That so called friendly contract ends after this upcoming season and then Zibanejad will be a FA and will certainly get more then Brassard’s current salary… and his salary is good for another three seasons.
Easy win for the senators. Mika never shows up in shape after the off-season and doesn’t appear to have the internal drive to be the best he can be. Brassard while older plays a much more competitive game and should actually use his elite wingers (Hoffman and Stone) better than zbinajad ever did.
Brassard is cost controlled the next 3 years and actually will be cheaper too going forward too
Absolutely love this deal for Ottawa they got a #1B center for a guy with talent but who really needs to learn to play motivated, and who can look great for 5 games and disappear for 10. He’s only 23 but he still hasn’t learned to be a professional.
Great trade for the Sens…..
Zibanejad is just a kid in a massive frame. Just turned 23. He’ll be fine. Just putting it all together.
I like the deal for both teams. Ottawa gets a solid 1a or 1b C with a friendly salary. Nyr gets even younger. Never a bad thing.
As far as setting the cost of a top D all Chirealli did was set the cost at a top three forward on your team. So it really depends on how good a teams top 3 are in regards to trading for a top 4 D
In regards to the Zibanejad’s trade. I like gettinBrassard, I don’t agree wih Striker that Zibanejad’s is about to have a break out season. I think last season was the top of his production but I could be wrong and if he does break out you can’t base trades on what it’s. Brassard is a solid scoring second line centre and it ends the complaints of Ottawa doing nothing to change their roster drastically. I do think the players are similar enough and Ottawa has sent the younger of the two so the draft pick exchange was a win by the Rangers, swapping a 2nd for a 3rd or 4th sure that still be overpaying a bit but a 7th. Ouch. Brassard has also been paid out a 2 million bonus easily making his so called big contract afforded to the Sens and Zibanejad is due a big raise, so with the up coining raises to guys like Hoffman and Ceci perhaps this trade was more a financial transaction than a hockey trade. A concerning possibility, yet if we see Hoffman and Ceci signing the next few days it would not surprise me.
I enjoy Ben on record of not being a Zabinajad fan and fail to see where anyone can claim a break out season is upon us. I like Brassard. I know what he will bring each game. He is a consistent scoring threat. Zabinajad was past over on the top line for Pageau when Turris got injured. I highly doubt Brassard would be passed over for Pageau. Brassard a contract is quite reasonable from what I can tell. Have no idea where the argument of it being a bad contract comes from.
Also with guys like White and Brown possibly making the team next year Zabinajad became expendable and his contract demand will be more than what Brassard makes now, so the trade makes sense from that stand point. Why pay an inconsistent 2 he line centre a hefty contract when you have guys coming up the pipe who may replace him when you can trade a guy who consistently scores under a reasonable contract, shake the team up a bit and by some time for the young guys to step into the league,
I think having White and Brown coming up over the next 2 years definitely came into play here. Brassard gives Ottawa excellent insurance and now if one of White or Brown pan out and become at least 2C’s, Ottawa is in great shape. If both are studs, look out. They can extend Turris in 2 years (likely ~$6M per), let Brassard walk and have enough money available to keep Karlsson for the rest of his career which is the most important thing. Brassard’s contract ends at the same time as Karlsson’s amazing deal at $6.5M per, so the money comes available at the perfect time.
In the short term, Ottawa saves enough money (i.e. actual dollars, cap space is less important to Ottawa) between this and the Phaneuf trade to extend Hoffman long term at ~$5.5M/year over 5/6 years and bridge Ceci. They even have the flexibility to extend Ceci longer term, but I prefer the 2 or 3 year bridge so they could extend him long term into his early thirties a la Subban. People complain about how Montreal bungled that process, but I’d rather have a star defenseman become UFA at 32/33 than in their late 20’s like Seth Jones or Aaron Ekblad.
Ottawa also needs money to extend Stone in 2 years which could be over $7M per year with the progression he’s had. In order of priority, I think Karlsson, Stone, Turris and Ceci are the players Ottawa has to plan the most for in the coming years. The first three are on tremendous team-friendly contracts currently and I think Ottawa will bridge Ceci at an affordable deal for 2 more years this summer.
Lastly, I’m betting that Ottawa will send Chabot to junior after a 9-game stint so his ELC will slide one more year. That would leave one year remaining on his ELC when Karlsson’s new deal kicks in at over $10M per year. I think another year of junior would do Chabot a lot of good plus it would really help our World Junior team.
Van, I’m not so sure that another year of junior will do anything to help Chabot’s development. He COULD show well enough at camp to make the the roster in a quasi-5/6 pairing but in that case I’d prefer too see them bring in a veteran 5/6 type to “mentor” him in those minimal minutes (NOT named Borowiecki or Wideman), then release him for the World Juniors in December while “managing” his minutes while he’s away with Wideman. Borowiecki is just useless.
I can find Sens fans who like and dislike Zibanejad, I am having difficulty finding a ranger fan who dislikes Brassard. Do any of you Ranger fans dislike him? On that basis alone I think the Sens will come out on top in this trade it is apparent Brassard is the more consistent player and I just learned Boucher has him in junior and Brassard is a Gatineau kid.
The more I digest this trade the more I am happy to have Brassard over Zabinejad yet I do think he draft pick exchange tilted the trade to NYR favour.
We’ll only know that when the 2018 draft actually takes place – and even then probably not for 2 or 3 years after that.
I agree George. Nothing was won or lost today. I think I’ll wait to see how both players perform and progress in the future. I certainly won’t be judging the deal off of Brassards popularity. Specifically soley off of his popularity.Most NY fans think Messier should be the 1st line center, Gm and coach, Leetch should be paired with McDonagh, Jeter still a Yankee shortstop, and Broadway Joe the Jets qb.
I understand year, I was just using it to determine how consistent Brassard is as a player. Mika can go games with out producing a point then suddenly have a 3 or 4 point game inflating his stats and masking his inconsistency with the final numbers, I don’t know Brassard that well so attempted to get NY fans take on him and it seems they all like him. So it has some value in determining the outcome of this trade at this point. But you are correct like any trade you have to wait and see,
I think though if the Rangers did not pay out the 2 million and Ottawa made the trade earlier, before that happened the draft picks may not have been swapped. So I guess 2 million is the cost of a 2nd round pick.
Something also note worthy to me is it seems experience has little value in hockey. Other professions that us average joes partake often demand experience or you need not apply. Lately I noticed in a hockey trade the young and due to that, less experienced guy often seems more desirable. Just an observation of mine.
But time will tell however NYR4life Mikka will leave you wanting more on many a night but he is in a contract year, I hear he is finally working out hard over the summer to come into he season in the best shape he can. I hope it is a trend that continues the rest of his career and it isn’t something he is doing as the result of up coming contract negotiations.
I do think this move will benefit Bobby Ryan. Zabinejad had trouble getting him the puck as he had to pass with his back hand. Them both being right handed. Zabinejad has one heck of a twisted bald too. Getting he left handed centre is a nice move for the Sens where Pageau, Turris are both right handed.
One interesting aspect of the players I hear is Zibanejad is better killing penalties but Brassard is good on the PP. These factors should benefit both teams in their respective areas. The Rangers were 26th at the PK. Ottawa needed to give Karlsson help distributing the puck on the PP.
I like Brassard a lot. He will not disappoint anyone in Ottawa. I knew coming into this offseason either Brassard or Stepan were going to be dealt. I’m not sure how or where NY plans on playing zbad. But one things for certain, being a Rfa in NY he will go through the same process as every player in NY has gone through for the past decade. He will either get a bridge soon, or at the 11th hour before arbitration.(McDonagh the sole exception to the rule.)
With that in mind, I wouldn’t mind seeing Hayes or Miller center the 2nd line. And seeing if they can make zbad work on the 3rd line and work him up to the 2nd in time.