NHL Rumor Mill – June 21, 2017

by | Jun 21, 2017 | Rumors | 139 comments

Plenty of wheeling and dealing heading toward the NHL expansion draft.

A look at some possible trades by the Vegas Golden Knights heading into tonight’s NHL expansion draft. 

TSN’s Bob McKenzie had an early-morning tweet storm listing several rumored deals involving the Vegas Golden Knights. He speculates as many as eight teams (Anaheim Ducks, Columbus Blue Jackets, Chicago Blackhawks, New York Islanders, Pittsburgh Penguins, Tampa Bay Lightning and perhaps the Minnesota Wild and Florida Panthers) could have trades in place with Vegas.

Regarding the Ducks, it’s believed Vegas will pass on Sami Vatanen and Josh Manson by selecting Clayton Stoner. In return, they could also receive Shea Theodore. It’s presumed the Panthers could swing a deal to get the Golden Knights to pass on Jonathan Marchessault, but McKenzie wonders if Vegas could get Marchessault and Reilly Smith from Florida and then move one or both. He notes there was talk about secondary expansion deals involving those two. 

McKenzie also hears talk of Vegas taking the contract of defenseman Jason Garrison off the Lightning’s hands. TAMPA BAY TIMES’ Joe Smith is also hearing the Bolts have deal in place with Vegas. He speculates they could package either Garrison or Andrej Sustr along with a prospect to the Golden Knights. 

SPECTOR’S NOTE: Looks like Vegas GM George McPhee’s been a busy man since the imposition of the expansion draft roster freeze on Saturday. He’s looking to load up on draft picks and prospects to stock his youth pipeline. He’s likely to continue wheeling and dealing after the roster freeze is lifted tomorrow at 8 am ET. 

STARTRIBUNE.COM: Michael Russo reports there’s a chance Minnesota Wild restricted free agent forward Erik Haula could sign with the Golden Knights today. “If that occurs, the Wild won’t lose defensemen Matt Dumba or Marco Scandella, center Eric Staal or any of its other unprotected players when the expansion team announces its initial roster later in the night.” The Golden Knights have a 72-hour window allowing them the opportunity to speak with restricted and unrestricted free agents. 

SPECTOR’S NOTE: Unlike the trades where teams are packaging a draft pick or prospect to steer Vegas toward selecting certain players, the Wild won’t have to part with an asset if Haula signs with the Golden Knights. 

TSN: Frank Seravalli yesterday reported the Toronto Maple Leafs were in talks with the Golden Knights in hopes of landing one of the players the latter selects via the expansion draft. Vegas GM George McPhee is willing to move some defensemen, prompting Seravalli to speculate on the possibility of the Leafs targeting Marc Methot (Ottawa), Colin Miller (Boston), Matt Dumba (Minnesota) or Sami Vatanen (Anaheim).

SPECTOR’S NOTE: Sounds like Dumba and Vatanen won’t be going anywhere so we can take them out of this equation. Methot or Miller, on the other hand, could be in play if Vegas selects them and decides to flip one of them for a draft pick or prospect. 

SPORTSNET: In his latest 30 Thoughts column, Elliotte Friedman reported he isn’t sure what the Pittsburgh Penguins are giving up to the Golden Knights in exchange for the latter’s expected selection of goalie Marc-Andre Fleury in the expansion draft. Vegas is expected to get David Clarkson, a first-round pick, a prospect and perhaps another player (William Karlsson?) from the Columbus Blue Jackets. They’re also reportedly getting a first-round pick and Mikhail Grabovski from the New York Islanders. Friedman wonders if the Carolina Hurricanes might offer up a draft pick to Vegas if they select either Cam Ward or Eddie Lack.

Talks between the Los Angeles Kings and Buffalo Sabres regarding left wing Evander Kane have reportedly cooled. Friedman wonders if the Kings could look at Nashville’s James Neal if he’s selected by Vegas in the expansion draft. He also believes the Montreal Canadiens and Toronto Maple Leafs could have interest in Marc Methot if the Senators lose him to Vegas. Both clubs, however, could be on his no-trade list. The Dallas Stars could also be an option.  

SPECTOR’S NOTE: The Golden Knights will select 30 players, but obviously they won’t keep all of them. One or two, perhaps more, could be flipped to rival clubs for draft picks, prospects or promising young players. They also have plenty of salary-cap space to use to their advantage with cap-strapped clubs. 

Speculation persists that the New York Islanders could make a big move soon. They’re linked to Colorado’s Matt Duchene, Edmonton’s Jordan Eberle and Montreal’s Alex Galchenyuk. Rumors link Anaheim Ducks pending UFA goalie Jonathan Bernier to the Philadelphia Flyers. The Vancouver Canucks are apparently offering Ryan Miller an incentive-laden contract. Chad Johnson, who was recently dealt to the Coyotes, could return to the Calgary Flames via free agency. 

Having dealt away Mike Smith and opting not to re-sign Shane Doan, the Arizona Coyotes could make some moves. Rangers fans speculated on a Derek Stepan/Antti Raanta-type deal. The Coyotes were interested in Stepan last year but that deal was dependent on something else happening, which obviously didn’t occur. The Rangers have also set a high asking price for Raanta.  

The $75 million salary cap makes it tight, but not impossible for the Washington Capitals to re-sign pending UFA T.J. Oshie. Friedman also reports pending UFA winger Jarome Iginla is planning on playing next season. 

 








139 Comments

  1. Why would the Pens need to give something extra for Vegas to take Fleury?

    • I think it has to do with the certainty of it all. The Pens could likely have gotten Calgary to take Fleury, but the return probably wouldn’t be max value. The Pens would then in turn lose Cole or some other asset that would likely cost as much or more to protect. Maybe it made just as much sense to just pay something to have Fleury moved knowing they don’t lose anything else.

      Also likely that it was something Fleury was open to, and they probably did whatever they could to do right by him. He is a proud Pen, and moving to a newly created team may have felt like a better situation for him.

      As long as the pick isn’t massively substantial, I think it would be worth something to make things easier and do right by a guy who did so much for your franchise. May not seem important, but if the cost is a 2nd, you basically have to consider keeping Fleury for the playoff run, and guaranteeing you lose no other roster player makes that a pretty good value, is good value, and if you get to do right by a big part of your franchise along the way, it’s a very modest price overall.

    • That was my thought when i heard that the other day. Its the best goaile available. The best penguin available. And they’re not blocking them from picking him. But Mcphee’s goal is to get as much as he can. So some ways this appears as he is helping the pens solve a problem and clear cap space. So Mcphee is saying im helping you so help me.

      • I think it’s as much a send off for Fleury. I mean if after everything Fleury did, and everything he went through, coming to terms with leaving, he was all of a sudden passed over only to endure trade speculation for another year, I think it would be a terrible situation for Fleury.

        So if a pick was thrown Vegas’ way to allow this to come to an end, Fleury get his new start as a franchise goalie elsewhere, then I think the pick will be overall worthwhile.

    • Because Vegas could target the much younger Rust and select him. For goalies they could easily go with Raanta, Grubauer and a crew of 1B’s from around the league. Allow competition and let the best rise.

      Pens getting MAF to Vegas is also about getting rid of his contract cap hit and taking back no salary in return, thus allowing the Pens to resign key pieces.

      The sweetener would be to ensure that happens.

      • If there wasn’t already a deal in place, Hornqvist would have been exposed instead of Rust.

        But, with a deal in place, the Pens could offer a show of respect to the veteran player.

    • I don’t think Pittsburgh gave Vegas anything extra. I think they have an agreement that Vegas will take MAF and that’s it.

      • They will – like they said above – Vegas could have taken Cole or Rust which Pittsburgh wouldn’t have wanted to part with but they make the deal to take Fleury and get something else in return. Murray’s extension kicks in at 3.75 per and Fleury’s on the books for 5.75 for this year and next. Pittsburgh loves Vegas taking that salary off their books and getting to keep Cole and Rust for a draft pick…

      • Agreed Swiss. That’s it in a nut shell.

      • ABSOLUTELY NOT,why would vegas help the penguins avoid a buyout for a guy who they could then sign much cheaper as a free agent…

        McPhee absolutely got something for helping them

    • McPhee should try to pry an asset off pens to ensure they take MAF. Plenty of younger cheaper goalies available who while may not have the pedigree are serviceable and rust would be a top 6 option in vegas.

    • Because Vegas told them if they didn’t they were selecting a different player.

    • It’s believed that MAF only waived his nmc for LV and nothing else. Therefore he couldn’t be traded to Calgary or anywhere else. Still though there be no reason to add someone or something else, unless it’s to ensure that LV takes MAF, just because he’s exposed doesn’t mean LV has to take him, so the additional asset would be for the certainty of selecting MAF, who LV more then likely would have selected regardless.

    • I actually read yesterday that it was the other way around. That Vegas was sending extra to Pittsburgh for talking MAF into playing for them. I guess, before all your heads explode, we will find out today. I also read speculation that the Penguins added a pick so that there was another asset( dman from another team) coming back to them. So, even though I like reading his work, forgive me Elliot if I don’t take your word this time. But again we shall see soon enough. I’m sure most of the trades will start leaking any time now.

      • Too late Deeeeee my head already exploded. Need to get some wipes for the monitor.

  2. Why would the Penguins have to give up anything if they claim Fleury? Sometimes Friedman just doesn’t seem to get it. Aren’t most teams dealing to avoid the Knights taking their players?

    • It’s fairly important to the Pens that they get Fleury off the payrole. That is leverage for Vegas.

    • I would take rust over MAF real fast. He is a great goalie, probably top 15-20, but just past his prime, so only teams that want him are playoff contenders. None of them around with over 5 mill free

      • Exactly.

      • I disagree with this. How easily we forget that he just beat the caps in the playoffs, Washington severely outplayed the pens in the series and they were lucky to have MAF.
        While a pick is not out of the questions, the discussions probably began a lot earlier. Rutherford probably told vegas that we’ll expose him if you take him, otherwise we are trading him at the deadline.

      • As I said, with the Fleury deal, the Pens did what they could to ensure they could keep Fleury for the playoffs, and he could move forward with some certainty in his future.

        I think a pick is worth it from the Pens point of view. That one pick almost acts as the cost of keeping Fleury as an own rental, protecting another asset, getting cap relief, and doing everything you can to make this as easy as possible for a guy who gave you everything.

        Well worth the price, especially considering the cup win makes the price worth it, but also makes the best pick you can lose a 31st. Most likely it’s the 62nd pick though.

      • Goalies aren’t past their prime at 32. Not even close especially declining superstar goalies like MAF, they just become really good goalies. Roy, Miller, Luongo, Brodeur, Lundqvist, Hasek, Joseph, Belfour, Thomas, yada, yada, yada, I could go on & on all played well into their late 30’s at a very high level many elite.

        Most goalies don’t even become starters till their 26. Then they play 10 to 12 years at a very high level at least the really good 1’s like MAF. Who be the time he retires in 5 or 6 years will be top 5 in almost any goalie stat of significance.

    • Maybe I was not reading that correctly. Does Friedman what the Penguins might give to the Knights to not take Fleury? Maybe I don’t get it sometimes? Ha! Ha! But my actual take on that is let Vegas take Fleury and go after a free agent defender after all the dust settles. If Pittsburgh can win back to back Cups with that defence then a decent free agent or two would support the odds many are giving them to complete the threepeat. I was on record many times suggesting Pittsburgh did right by keeping their team intact as they had a chance to complete the repeat. Not that I predicted they would as predicting NHL playoffs is pointless and look what happened. They now owe it to their core group to keep pushing for more. Their core guys are continuing their pursuit of excellence, therefore, management needs to support them. Pittsburgh does have an excellent opportunity to win three in a row! This is not a prediction just an observation.

      • What FA defender is worth going after this summer? There is not one that is worth what they are going to be paid. I’d rather trade with Vegas and get a Brandon Davidson or a Colin Miller for a couple picks that are not first round picks. It’s nice the Pens will have both a first round pick and cap space after the roster is assembled for the first time in a long time.

      • How is Vegas getting Davidson?

    • Vegas has a plan in place. They know their selections. Pending any deals they sit back and wait for the phone to ring,they dont show their cards.If I’m Pittsburgh and need to get Fleury off the books,I have to sweeten the deal with a prospect or draft pick. Vegas may just want Rust.Vegas dictates this whole process. Just like the Hawks,they want Krueger off the books. If I’m Vegas and Chicago comes to me with that, I say OK I take TVR in expansion with side deal of Krueger and a prospect. I would love to be in the Vegas war room. A chess match without seeing the other sides pieces.

    • Vegas knows Pitts is trying to unload MAF and there lies the catch. They know Pitts situation with Murray. There are other goalies they can take, younger, cheaper and with potential. Remember Vegas is not building a team that will immediately contend for the cup so selecting MAF who is older isnt on their “must select” list but rather would be nice but not necessarily required. By selecting MAF they are doing Pitts’s favor and by maximizing there leverage they also get a bit more and why not? It’s Pitts who is in this mess by allowing themselves to have reached this point without to had traded one of their goalies before the ED.

    • Because Vegas told them if they didn’t they would be selecting a different player. Numerous teams are making side deals with Vegas to select specific players. This isn’t any different. Pit wants them to take MAF & are willing to make sure that happens. All a question of perception.

    • It’s a guarantee they take him. You happen to see that contract? That’s why.

  3. Bernier to the Flyers? That’s hilarious! Good goalies have lost it there, imagine what will happen to Bernier?

    • Turn into a superstar?

  4. If George McFee signs Haula instead of taking Dumba he’s the dumbest manager ever. The Wild would have to throw in one hell of a kicker to make that happen.

    Even if McPhee doesn’t want Dumba there are half a dozen teams that would pay him threw the nose for Dumba. He could get 3 Haula equivalents for Dumba.

    • AGREE!!!!! Though someone signed Bryzgalov to a ridiculous contract so he is competing for the dumbest GM award….

      Must take DUMBA unless MIN is throwing in a top 10 1st rd pick. Bc that is what it takes to get Dumba from MIN in a non expansion trade.

      • Alex tuch and a first to vegas for them to stay away from dumba and scandella! Vegas takes huala

      • If that’s the price paid I might have still have selected Dumba. Tuch is a monster of a young man & they tend to need far more development time than smaller forwards to grow into those massive frames but that may time line very well for Vegas.

        If it’s Tuch, Minny’s 1st in 2018, Haula & the condition is Minnesota can choose 2019 instead it’s palatable but would still have preferred Dumba as Minny will be picking late.

  5. I hope the next couple of days do not disappoint. All this excitement and anticipation…
    Hossa retirement helps Chicago a lot !…Sounds like he has the ” Gunk” from his equipment….Ron Flockhart had to retire for the same deal…
    Still predict Vegas is going after Patrick some how. Flip a good goalie and their 6th to Phil ? Mcrimmon (from Brandon) would want him badly.

    • I’ve been saying the same thing SilverSeven. As you are aware Mcrimmon was the Owner, Gm and coach of the Brandon Wheat Kings, (Patrick team) and is still the owner of the team.

    • Hossa going on LTIR helps more than retirement.

      • This stinks no pun intended. Very convenient for both Chi & Hossa. Contract drops to a mil per & Hossa has some mystery ailment we have never heard about till yesterday & now Chi gets to put him on LTIR eventually.

      • You and I both Striker, this is pretty sketchy

      • Just seems odd & incredibly convenient for all. Not meant to slight Hossa in any way. A fabulous NHL player, future hall of famer.

      • Chicago must have known this before they made the Vegas deal which combined with Hossa LTIR gives them about 8.5 mill more cap space. Thats why the Seabrook rumors were shot down so quick.

    • Doesn’t Hossa’s remaining contract remain on Chicago’s books? He’s over 35 so his cap hit remains in place. Isn’t that right?

      • Hossa’s contract was signed before he was 35.

      • & when put on LTIR his age isn’t an issue regardless.

        He’s not retiring he’s apparently injured, unfit to play.

  6. Word has it that Vegas has selected 9 defenders. That’s right, 9! that would mean that at least 2 are going to be used as trade chips. Of those on the exposed list I see Dumba, Vat/Manson, Methot and miller being the likely trade candidates. I don’t expect the Knights to be selecting 4 of these players. Likely there’s some form of a deal in place for Anaheim and something potentially in the works for the Wild.

    Lets take a look at Staal;
    -Cap friendly contract
    -Two way center
    -Can put up points
    -On a team in win now mode
    -Signed for two more years

    Why was he exposed? Because the Wild want to have him there as a “possible selection” for Vegas if a deal to keep Dumba falls through. I believe that if Vegas doesn’t make a deal for Dumba, they’re going to take Staal. Staal is something which is not at all available from any other team. This would be a way to prevent Cody Eakin from being in their top two lines as a center.

    • Vegas was required to select a minimum of 9 D.

    • Hey Boss, Vegas already took Haula and apparently sweeteners from the Wild.

  7. Rumors of Vegas NOT taking ANA’s Vatanen or Manson to draft over 30 yrs of age STONER are crazy. The best possible pick Vegas would get is a 1st rd pick 2018 bc Dallas has their 2017. Along with the fact it will not be in the top 15 bc Ana seems to always make the playoffs.

    SO why do it? Better to select Vatanen and keep him or flip him for boat load. Not sure stockpiling youth of lower round picks makes sense on this move while filling your roster with Stoner who ANA clearly does not want…
    McPhee pulling off a Forsberg to Nashville type move this draft again.

    Same type of crud with MIN..nbot selecting Dumba to sign Haula… sheesh.

    • deal was made prior to lists being summited to prevent ana from trading those pieces for what they could get and leaving vegas with scraps and no additional asset.

    • If Vegas is getting Theodore as compensation to select Stoner, that really isn’t that bad of a move.

      • Can Theodore be sent to the AHL next year?

        That’s the type of player that Vegas can’t get in the expansion draft and will have to trade for them.

        Given Minny’s surplus of prospects, I get Vegas gets a few to lay off Dumba. Or they’ll get one and take Staal.

      • Yes Theodore is still waiver exempt.

    • Apparently the price paid to pass was Theodore.

      Considering this deal was made while Anaheim still had leverage and options, this is an excellent haul for Vegas. I thought for sure Anaheim would have been content to let Montour and Theodore fight for Vatanens spot and wouldn’t have really missed a beat. They could easily have gotten Bieksa to waive or bought him out, then protected Manson, and traded Vatanen for a 1st and a solid/good prospect. This would have also given them even more cap flexibility.

      Considering this deal was made before the freeze, Vegas manged to get a ton of value.

      The Minny deal makes so much less sense to me. Haula plus a prospect? That deal was apparently made after the freeze, Minny had a much worse situation, and I think Dumba was far more valuable than what Vegas is getting, so why not select him or even flip him for more. The wild did not have near the leverage before the deadline either as they would have needed to make a lot of moves to make deny Vegas assets. The whole thing seems strange.

      I had said before I think Vegas needs to risk losing out on a deal in a few situations to keep prices high ahead of the deadline, and they did seem to do that. Minnesota was a team I thought they should really play hard with given they had no way out of exposing a really good player. So I am shocked if it’s true that they paid a lesser price for protection after the freeze than Anaheim paid prior to.

      • Perhaps Anh still plans to trade a Dman this summer for a #1 or 2 LW+.

        I need to see these supposed side deals before I lose it. Ha-ha! If the NYI & Min deals are as is being reported then McPhee did Vegas an injustice & didn’t get anything near what the players he could have selected are worth but I have to assume we aren’t getting all the facts; assets moved.

        Again. All we really knew going into the protected rosters was 3 teams had side deals before the protected rosters were submitted. Anh, Clb & Pit. Not what these side deals were but it allowed these 3 teams to expose players that would otherwise not have been exposed & a different path chosen prior. Like you say, Anh ask’s Bieksa to waive & trades Vatanen prior potentially to solve their protected roster issues.

      • I know what you mean, but unfortuneately all we have right now is speculation to judge haha.

        If they end up trading Theodore to keep Vatanen, then trade Vatanen anyway that would just be bad asset management to me.

        Apparently Haula is now signed, but we will need to see what the full deal was before making a real judgement. If they get a 1st or even a conditional 1st with a top prospect and Haula maybe it’s a little more palatable, but I would still figure the price to shop Dumba is higher. I think the thing that would shock me is if Vegas goes through the motions of playing chicken ahead of the freeze, then doesn’t leverage that to pry more out of a team than they would have prior to the freeze, I think they really make a mistake.

        I would think if there is no deal in place, I would now approach teams with the attitude that “I now own playerX as an asset, now you need to offer a trade that would make me consider trading him back”

      • Depends on what the deal might be. Perhaps the team willing to pay the best price for Vatanen didn’t have room to protect him. Not saying it will be now but possible. Anh needs a #1 LW, ideally a #2 as Ritchie isn’t ready yet, although Cogliano plays an important role with Kesler & Silfverberg on the 2nd line.

        Anh has 7 solid Dman still. Fowler LH, Lindholm LH, Vatanen RH, Bieksa RH, Montour RH, Manson RH & Larsson LH. Larsson won’t be in the NHL to be a #7 Dman he needs to play so he sticks or goes to the AHL as could Montour he is still waiver eligible. That said both are NHL ready.

        Moving Vatnanen to make room for Larsson still makes sense to me, just a question of when.

      • Maybe Danny… but the price teams were getting for these players prior to expansion wasn’t good enough to pull off pre-list deals, forcing teams to work with Mcphee. Now expansion list was the big reason why these deals must have been low balls but maybe the market for d, or specifically minny/isles d isn’t as strong as people think.

      • Chrisms, there is definitely a chance that is a big part of it. In the end there is only a market if there are buyers and sellers who agree on a price.

        For me it’s more about the disparity in prices. We disagreed heading into expansion about the way Vegas would maximize value, and while I may have disagreed I understood the concept either way and thought both had validity. Vegas seemed to kind of go it’s own way. They kept prices high before the freeze, but they didnt’ follow through with then extorting max value (again this is all based on the rumors that are out there, so could be different).

        So I guess it’s just that going in I thought Anaheim had less work to do, and was probably considering trading from their D to add anyway, and make room for guys like Theodore, Montour and Larsson. So them making a deal surprised me somewhat, especially considering the reported price.

        Minnesota had almost no way to use other teams to get out of a bad situation, so I assumed they would work the hardest to get a deal prior to the freeze. They didn’t, but then Vegas doesn’t seem to have really been that hard on them afterwards.

        So I guess it comes down that things happened quite differently that I expected based on what I thought made more sense going in, that I am having a hard time seeing the logic in it. That doesn’t mean it’s not possibly there, just that I don’t see it at this point.

        Whole thing may be a lot clearer tomorrow.

      • why danny? they had extra d… perfect for teams like jersey, leafs, ari. they could have moved those players for assets and protected whats left. they decided the price of keeping those guys outweighed the cost of losing them.

  8. Well I’m hoping Craig Button was correct in his Mock Draft having LV taking Jimmy Hayes off the Bruins. With all do respect to Button, I do not see LV not taking Colin Miller. I hope button is right and i’m wrong.

    • Colin Miller? I haven’t seen anyone with a clue (rules out button) taking anyone but Miller off the Bruins and there are many teams that would trade for him.

      Who is better, Miller or TVR?

      • MG I should clarify this was before the official list was out, it was Button and another tsn writer both had Hayes. I would say even without C.Miller on the list I be taking Mcquaid or K.Miller (if C.Miller was protected) before Hayes.
        Still disappointed with Colin being on that list.

      • Miller has more offensive potential, TvR is a better defensively, both have years of development to figure out what they truely may be.

      • Caper.

        I just avoid Button. Unless Boston is paying Vegas to select Hayes he’s not being selected. I’m surprised he wasn’t bought out immediately. Boston will get a 2nd window though.

      • MG i don’t watch Chicago enough to give an informed opinion on TVR, other then hes playing behind some solid D there and probably not getting the ice time needed to further develop his game.
        Colin Miller was forced into a bigger role in the playoffs and i thought he was solid, strong skater, can skate the puck out or make a nice crisp first pass. Needs to develop the defensive side of his game but has the size to do it, he also makes some blunders when heavy pressure is applied and i’m guessing that’s why he was left unprotected. Solid player in my view and if he can clean up the decision making, LV is going to have a very good dman

      • Caper, perhaps we get lucky & VGK selects McQuad? 1 can always hope.

      • Striker, Gallant and Mcquaid are both PEI boys. So maybe.

      • I’d prefer to lose McQuad but the cost to Bos in expansion isn’t really significant. We lose 1 & keep the other. Either is a small price to pay for a 17 mil windfall.

    • Button is usually wrong;)

  9. If the Islanders and ANA rumors are true then teams are paying a premium price to both have vegas Aviod players AND have them Take players… Quite a coup for the GM’s of those teams to kill two birds with one stone. It will be pricey but quite the nifty wheelin and dealin.

  10. If the Pens send anything besides MAF to Vegas it’s because they are getting back a defenseman or a backup goalie or both. Vegas will have access to many who would interest them.

    Rust would have never been exposed if Jimmy didn’t already have a deal in place.

    If Vegas hadn’t agreed to take him, Marc would have been traded, either at the deadline or before Saturday.

    The deal is “we won’t trade him, then you take him”.

    Not sure why anyone would doubt Rutherford after the last 18 months.

    But in case you do, Marc is flying to Vegas today. And it isn’t for a vacation.

    • doubt anyone thinks a deal isn’t in place. The question remains if Mcphee held up GMJR for something else to ensure he took MAF. Would be smart GM’ing to use his advantage with the specter of paying 10 mil in goalies looming over the pens. And MArc wouldn’t have been traded at the deadline as he agreed to waive his NMC for expansion to prevent that. Doesn’t mean GMJR had a deal in place with vegas at the time… just that he didn’t need to worry about it at that time. Vegas doesn’t make that deal then anyway due to things like injuries etc… in fact neither does the pens. What if Murray suffered a serious career threatening injury at the end of the year and a deal was in place to trade MAF? No, the deal with vegas happened after the playoffs.

      • Marc’s wife was house and school shopping in Vegas well over a month ago. Marc has known for a long time he’ll be going to Vegas, per Josh Yohe.

        And if McPhee tried to extort him, Jimmy would say “Get lost, we’ll trade him and protect Rust and you can have your choice of old, tired players who are a year from being UFA (Horny or Cole) instead of a franchise goalie.”

      • Take Cole flip him for a solid pick & prospect. Ton’s of goalies available in expansion draft as good or better than MAF at significant lower cap hits. My favorite goalie available is Grubauer but I would also select Picard, Mrazek, Alshuller & Ullmark the last 2 waiver exempt so they can head to the minors but are also the best players available from Carolina & Buffalo. No slight to Bogosian just to expensive & injury prone.

        I have maintained something is moving with MAF to Vegas. He will be Grubauer’s mentor until finally traded at some point before his contract expires. Think leading up to 2018-19’s trade deadline.

      • Marc just stood on his head to beat the #4 seed and the President’s Trophy winner despite the Pens being outshot in almost every game.

        He’s universally lauded as the greatest teammate anyone has ever had.

        Fans here just lined up at 6 am to meet him at 7 pm to say good bye.

        Pass on that to start a franchise in a novice market for Ian Cole and Petr Mrazek or whoever?

        I wouldn’t. And judging by Marc’s flight plans, nor did McPhee.

        As I’ve said for a while, Marc will be the face of the franchise and will be introduced as such on stage in Vegas tonight.

      • MG.

        I agree with almost all of that. This is a essentially a salary dump & to solve Pits expansion draft issues. This deal was apparently worked out long ago. Steven, Scott or you possibly referenced this months ago that a deal was in place with Vegas. They heard from their wife’s brother’s, sister who’s chiropractor has a friend that is a message therapist who’s cousin knows the Zamboni driver, who’s sister is dating 1 of the Pit trainers that saw MAF texting his agent.

        The only part I don’t agree with is MAF being the face of the franchise. Goalies rarely are. Vancouver tried that it was a disaster. MAF may not even make it through the season before being traded. I assume he will play 1 full season but he is their to mentor Grubauer who will be Vegas’s starter by next season.

        Vegas doesn’t need a face. The novelty alone will pack the building. Almost every 1 I know has already said they are planning trips to Vegas next season to go to a Knights game.

      • And Marc still has a NTC and with so few teams needing a goalie it might as well be a full one. He could block a trade to all other teams essentially meaning GMJR can’t just trade him if he doesn’t like the destination.

      • Hasek wasn’t the face of the franchise in Buffalo? Roy wasn’t the face of the franchise in Montreal? Price isn’t now? And that’s off the top of my head. It’s been done and tell me, who is available in this draft that is more marketable? All the people who keep saying that Vegas doesn’t need a marketable personality to help sell them are people who are already fans of the sport. None of you are thinking in terms of selling to women and children who have little to no introduction to hockey and the team needs those demographics. Especially children for obvious reasons. Sorry, Grubauer may be a good starter some day, he may not. But he’s not today and today Vegas has to sell a whole new fan base on their endeavour because once the novelty wears off you can’t hope to attract enough lifelong hockey fans in that market to fill the arena. And that’s how you are thinking. There is not one other player that will be selected today that can start selling Vegas tomorrow on the level that Fleury can. I’m not biased in this case(I actually was hoping for a different direction in goal for awhile now) it’s just fact.

      • Deeeeee

        Vegas is going to have no issues selling tickets. Winning sells tickets. The novelty alone will but them 5 years. No other team in the NHL has the dynamic in play that Vegas has. 29th largest metropolis by population, another 100,000 in town on almost any given night to gamble, see shows or attend trdae shows during the day.

        They will build their fan base just like almost every other team has over time with assets acquired primarily in the draft.

        Goalies aren’t the face of their franchises except in very odd circumstances although I would argue Price is today & Brodeur & Roy were.

        MAF is not going to be the face of Vegas. He won’t be there long enough to be. There are tons of teams in the NHL today that don’t have what I would call a face. Who’s the face in Arz, Cal, Car, Col, Clb, Dal, Det, NJ, NYR, Phi, Stl, Van, or Win. Or the really strong teams, who do you pick as the face of these teams, Anh, Bos, Chi, Flo, Min, Nas & SJ, I say they have more than 1 but several.

        This is a team sport. I have never bought the I pay to go watch player X. I go to be entertained & watch a team win. No 1 player can dominate hockey like in many other sports. You need 7 solid core players to be a cup winner & solid team. A superstar goalie can look pretty average pretty fast playing behind a bad team. Just ask Schneider how he enjoyed last season.

      • @Striker-I am getting sick of your trolling me when I am not part of the thread. It seems that if someone dares having an opinion contrary to you-its not valid.

      • @ Striker – I can appreciate that you understand hockey but I think your knowledge of marketing is highly lacking.
        Having marketable players and personalities goes a long…LONG way in any sports organizations which are essentially a business. For you to say that the product will sell itself is extremely naive.
        If you think there won’t be billboards saying 3-time Stanley cup champion MAF etc etc then you are kidding yourself.
        You are also thinking that every consumer in the product is the same as you, which is not the case.

        How many novelty businesses have longevity? You think these fidget spinners are going to be around in two years? (playing with one now, these things are awesome – but thats besides the point)

      • Scott not meant as such & you should note that your information was correct, accurate & way ahead of time. Meant to be humorous not offensive. Dam text. I don’t disagree with you infact just the opposite, sorry you took it as such.

        Well done, good job & thank you.

      • Pittsburgh media reporting a pick going to vegas so they take Marc.. all but assured.

      • Taz.

        Of course they will. I just don’t think it’s all that significant in the scheme of things. Winning sells tickets, building a solid entertaining team, with solid up & coming superstars should eventually sell tickets. Jordan Staal won a cup in Pit, how are ticket sales going in Carolina? That was a huge acquisition & signing by them. It’s done nothing, in fact it’s gotten progressively worse. It’s to bad as this is a great up & coming team yet still no support.

        How about that superstar Hall going to NJ? Is he selling tickets? Tavares in NYI? Jagr in Flo? No none of these players are helping at the gate. Why? Long years of losing & in the case of NJ boring hockey. Ottawa couldn’t sell out all their conference home playoff dates! What’s up with that. Karlsson is the best Dman in the world.

        Your reading into my comments. Of course they will market it anyway they see beneficial but MAF isn’t selling tickets, the tickets sold in the time he will be there are already sold.

        My clients would find your perception of my marketing skills amusing as I consult on theirs. Ha-ha! I have copied & pasted to several of them. Ha-ha!

      • Striker, you need to tell that to the fans of Winnipeg, “Winning sell tickets.” no problem selling them here, 1 playoff in 6 years.
        However i don’t think the fans in Las Vegas will have that kind of passion (6yrs) but there should be no issues to build this team correctly over three years to see decent progress.

      • Wasn’t the deal to move to Win pre assured ticket sales for 5 years. It’s also a Canadian team selling the game here isn’t an issue.

        Plus it’s a fun team to watch & although only 1 playoff appearance in 6 years they have been in the hunt. In the lock out shortened season playing in the East they just missed finishing 9th.

        They are & have been a competitive team for 5 of those 6 years & again a fun team to watch play but were also rebuilding. What face is selling tickets for them?

      • @striker are you saying star power brings nothing to the organizations you name, lets subtract Tavares from NYI, what affect is that having on revenues, you want to work that out? You are spinning this to support your argument. Where am I saying that marketing is the only factor that counts? I’m saying it is a big piece of any organizations.
        You however are completely discounting it.

        I work with a tons of Marketing Managers, VPs, CEOs of Enterprise grade corporations.
        In addition, without giving too much detail of my employer it is a large publicly traded company. I handle worldwide revenue, have input on our website development, all marketing initiatives run through me before being submitted to the CEO, so while I have no idea what your job title is or what it is you do I can tell you that I know what I am talking about.

        If this is the material you share with your clients? Tell me more about how that conversation goes ‘Hey you wont believe what this random guy on a forum said to me, LOL’
        You better hope they never find me or your book of business will shrink up real fast.

      • Not at all Taz. You market what you have, all of it, promote everything, multiple players including MAF every little bit helps it just does nothing for me or my group of friends & associates to motivate us to but season tickets or merchandise, we buy team merchandise not player merchandise, all my jersey’s have my name on the back of them.

        What I’m saying is that no 1 player is the determining factor in helping to sell a team not even Tavares for that matter. It’s everything & 1 player isn’t even the most important. Entertainment & winning are. Even when winning NJ struggled to sell tickets for many of those glory years, people weren’t entertained so they didn’t go.

        How much would NYI’s revenue decline if Tavares wasn’t there? Virtually not at all. The vast majority of their revenue comes from their local cable TV package which has been in place for decades related to market demographics & monies from the league. If Tavares is moved another solid asset is returning. NYI has the 3rd worst attendance in the league right now with Tavares. Attendance for NYI has declined the last 3 seasons in a row & that’s with the novelty of the move to Barclays a brutal venue for hockey, 2 of which were 100+ point playoff seasons! How do you explain that with your argument?

        Teams only get 100% of merchandise sales with in a 75 mile radius of their building, the rest goes to the NHL to be split equally.

        Canadian teams account for 60% of league revenue & if not for NYR it would be significantly higher than that. This is a gate driven sport currently with a few minor exceptions. No ticket sales especially playoff ticket sales & it’s hard to turn a profit for 2/3rd’s the league. The reason NYI can is their local cable package & it has nothing to do with Tavares. No playoff revenue this year & they won’t be turning a profit.

        I’m just getting ready to downsize my business, selling the controlling portion of my book, with a 10 year buy out on the remainder, time to semi retire & take on a new challenge at soon to be 55. Freedom 55 was the plan 20 years ago. Check please. It will take almost 2 years to complete. Taking on a new venture needed to free up time. I can’t see you every needing what I sell so no concerns there. Ha-ha!

      • Taz.

        I think we agree to disagree & there are things we agree on just a ton gets muddled in text & could be easily debated over beers.

        But that’s never happening.

        I don’t feel a specific player sells significantly more tickets than the team might sell otherwise.

        We have teams with Superstars that can’t sell tickets now, we have other teams that with their turn arounds, thru rebuilds have started to do so. Due to the superstar? Partly but due to winning more.

  11. Lyle.

    Vegas won’t be signing Haula as a UFA if Minny doesn’t give them a serious incentive to do so. McKenzie said in that same twitter that the compensation maybe Tuch. If that’s all Minny has to pay to pass on Dumba that’s as brutal as the rumor coming out of NYI. Dumba is worth far more than Tuch an elite prospect & a 3rd line UFA C.

    • Elite was a bad choice of words. Lets say solid prospect.

    • I agree, I am scratching my head in the difference in the reported prices.

      Anaheim makes a deal ahead of the freeze, while they still have leverage, and while they have some players to expose, they have an easier out in that they can get Bikesa to Waive, and trade Vatanen for good value, and still have two kids able to come in. Vegas getting Theodore is a massive win, and I think you can even make the argument that for Vegas Theodore has more value than Vatanen anyway.

      Minnesota has no deal, never had near the leverage as there was no solving all of their issues, and can manage to work out a softer price after the deadline? The price to keep Dumba should be at least Dumba’s value. That’s aside from the fact Vegas should have been shopping Dumba elsewhere to drive that price up. Toronto would have started at Brown & 1st, Montreal probably starts with Galchenyuk+, Dallas offers #3 overall to start.

      I don’t understand how Vegas get’s less than the value of any of these packages, but it sounds like they did.

      • Alex tuch and a first for them to stay away from dumba scandella

      • is it a 1st?

      • I only heard that it was conditional, so we don’t really know much. Conditional already makes it sound a little weaker, but it could very well be a conditional first maybe in 2018 where Minnesota can choose to move it to 2019 if they don’t make the playoffs. It gets a little closer if it’s some sort of conditional first, or maybe the condition was on Haula signing, or even a condition around an additional much later in the draft.

        Hard to judge on speculation, but all in all it sounds like they paid less than Anaheim despite being in a worse situation.

  12. As I only generally come on here for about an hr in the Am. I usually read the previous days comments first. Holy crap, that was a lot of reading 149 comments and not sure one.
    I think I have to go buy one of them fidget things the kids play with, my attention span is generally only good for a couple lines (sorry Striker) and then my head hurts when I’m trying figure out chrisms sarcasm. Other then a few personal shots, well done with some good discussions.

  13. Lame. The side deals and subsequent trades won’t be announced until tomorrow.

    The roster will be announced tonight based off the 30 picks only.

    Such an odd rollout.

    • Only the 3 way deals are going to be delayed. Players acquired in trade with Vegas will be announced. Players them flipped to another team will be Thursday.

      I don’t like how the NHL has chosen to deal with all of this. Way to much info in far to short a time frame to digest & completely takes away from the awards ceremony.

      Which are you more interested in. Vegas’s picks & trades or the Awards Ceremony?

      I’ll start. Vegas baby.

      • I never watch their D-list award show.

        I actually don’t care about the awards themselves anymore either as the PHWA is so full of Puck Daddies and his ilk.

        “Stanley Cups and scoring titles are the only things that matter, because no one votes on those.” – Mario Lemieux

      • Ha-ha! I love that saying. Did he have a cigarette hanging out of his mouth when you heard or saw him say it?

        I loved Babcock’s saying to during the World Cup. “I have real enjoyed watching team NA play in this tournament, they are really fast & exciting but I like winning more.”

    • Lebrun must be wrong as Bobby Mc is reporting as you have stated. All trades will come tomorrow. It didn’t make sense to do it all in 1 day. To much info.

      Names are starting to trickle out now.

  14. It may be early to ask this but how will Las Vegas fill out their AHL roster? Any rules in this regard?

    • Vegas has already signed 2 players heading to the minors. Duke & Hyka. They will becoming out of the expansion draft with at least 30 players; 2 goalies should be waiver exempt Altshuller & Ullmark; if selected, it’s being reported at least 8 side deals have been made, many of those assets coming will be waiver exempt; Theodore, Tuch, etc. As many as 4 to 6 other trades are in that will see players Vegas acquired flipped to other teams, again for draft picks & prospects primarily.

      Vegas will also be flipping assets, specifically Dman & at least 1 if not 2 goalies, again these will be for picks & prospects. No team is allowed more than 50 in force NHL/AHL/ECHL contracts. Not all players that play in the AHL are signed to NHL contracts & other teams often loan players to other teams.

      This won’t be an issue by the start of the season.

      • they aharing an ahl team so don’t need to stock a whole team… did they ever get an echl agreement?

      • No Vegas has their own AHL franchise. They bought the Chicago AHL franchise. The Quad City Mallards will be their ECHL affilate.

      • I coulda swore they are sharing the ahl franchise…

        after looking its sorta both

        The St. Louis Blues will not renew our primary affiliation with the AHL’s Chicago Wolves past the 2016-17 season,” Blues general manager Doug Armstrong said in a statement Tuesday. “We will associate with the Vegas Golden Knights and supply players to the Golden Knights’ AHL affiliate next season.”

  15. I would actually like to trade the #31 pick to Vegas to get back a young D and/or a backup.

    Say, TVR or Miller and Raantta for #31 and one of the Pens mid level but waiver eligible propsects like Dominik Simon.

    That would just leave the #7 D and # C spots to fill and give them the money to sign Nick Bonino.

    • That’s a terrible deal for Pittsburgh. A mediocre dman and a backup goalie they don’t need. I want to keep the pick, trade for an early second and put a couple of young dmen or a centre in the system. Someone like Uhro Vaakanainen with the first and Morgan Frost with second would be perfect. I’m giving Jarry his shot until he blows it.

      • A young top 4 D man who will still be RFA when their current deals end and one of the elite backups in hockey? 2 guys worth a second round pick each for the last pick of the first round?

        And it lets you keep Bonino.

        When you are trying to threepeat.

        That better be one great prospect.

  16. Marian Hossa out for the season. Classy guy, hope all goes well. Being treated for skin disorder and side effects won’t allow him to play.

    • No slight to Hossa. Long prosperous career & a solid 2 way player who once had elite offensive skills but this stinks to me. Very convenient for both Hossa & Chicago that he’s headed to LTIR eventually & he won’t have to play for a mil per season.

      • That’s quite the statement Striker, he did score 26 goals last season.

      • Yes he did but what does that mean or what are you implying? You have lost me.

      • Why would Hossa sit out for the year? Because he doesn’t want a million dollars?

      • He will be put on LTIR & collect every dime of that mil & the future 3 mil. Chi will also get the 5.275 in cap relief his LTIR privides for the 4 years. A win win for both.

        Does Hossa want to keep playing at 38 for a mil a year? He’s earned the vast majority of that 12 year deal, 57.3 of the 63.3. Perhaps Chi coerced this like Tor with Robidas & Lupul.

        Marian you have been a great player, but we are going to start giving offensive opportunities & PP time to our younger players. You can kill penalties & play a 3rd or 4th line role but no PP time & we need to get these kids icetime. We hope you’ll stay & play but perhaps your alment is a good reason to shut it down.

        Your headed to the hockey hall of fame soon after you actually retire in 4 years & your jersey will evetually hang from the rafters with the greatest Hawks ever!

        Just saying it looks convenient, odd & stinks of collussion by both the player & team. Maybe not but certainly fishy.

      • @striker, yes the timing sucks and very convenient, why today? why not October? At second glance maybe more to this then meets the eye. 3 letters were released as someone pointed out in none of the letters (Chicago, Hossa, Doctor) was there any mention of trying to work his way back. Yes i’m now starting to smell the fish.

      • Think of how easy it will be for the Hawks to move the last 4 years of Hossa’s contract now. With insurance covering 80% and only $1 mill in actual dollars but a $5.275 cap hit …

  17. Vegas reportedly signs Haula, meaning no Staal or Dumba.

    I’ll wait to see what McPhee gets, Minny does have a bunch of nice young players.

    But, man, the chance to add either the best player (in terms of asset value) in Dumba or the only number one center available for a 3rd liner…better be a nice package.

    • I do not understand this either. If GM Fletcher was offered Haula and Tuch and a low round pick for Dumba…Fletcher would laugh at that GM….. so why did McPhee agree to this?

      3 years for Haula then he becomes an UFA.
      They could have resigned the 22 yr old Dumba to a Roman Josi type deal and have their top pairing Dman of the future.

      I am soooo lost on this move.

      may change my name to……. IhateMcPhee

      • I think we need to wait & see what was actually paid but I agree with you.

  18. I might be wrong about the Pens not sweetening to move MAF…because I was right about the deal being done back in February.

    “Pierre LeBrun‏Verified account @PierreVLeBrun 2h2 hours ago

    People wondering why Penguins are sending a pick to Vegas to take Fleury. Actually makes sense. Believe deal was done a while back (con”t)..”

    Fleury didn’t start playing well until after the deadline, so maybe they did have to offer something at that point to ensure he was taken.

    I still think the Pens are getting back a player from Vegas in some form (they were reportedly hoping to get Ryan Reaves from STL, which might explain his protection), but we’ll see.

    I almost want to see what happens if the Pens had to pay to move Fleury because the fans and media here destroyed the Pirates for doing the same thing with prospects to move a pitcher. I love it when people say the complete opposite in the same situation. It’s amusing and revealing.

  19. Just to touch on this one as well, I really like the reported deal with the Panthers and Knights as I think it’s actually solid all-round.

    Apparently, the Knights simply agreed to also take Rielly Smith along with Marschesault. This frees up cap and money for the Panthers, but Smith is hardly a typical cash dump. A little overpaid if he can’t hit 20 goals again, but he is a pretty solid winger overall, twice scoring 20 or more goals and 50 or more points out of 4 full seasons.

    All in all Florida gets a little relief, but Vegas walks away with two wingers who should combine for 40+ goals next year for less than $6M total. Considering they won’t get a lot of wingers capable of 20+ goals, this is decent value, so I think they actually view also taking Smith as an added asset rather than a bad contract.

    • Agreed! Good asset management by McPhee here shame he did not do the same with Minnesota’s Dumba or Anaheim’s Sami Vatanen.

    • Great penalty killer as well & logs huge minutes, 3rd for forwards in TOI/GP in Flo. I like Smith, the salary is just a little high for me but a solid 2 way player with finishing skills. If this is the deal I really like this deal for Vegas.

      Florida loses more money than any team in the NHL. Unfortunate they have to keep giving up assets to try & manage their internal cap issues. The don’t have the sweetheart lease deal Carolina has.

  20. Cody Eakin is reportedly the pick from DAL.

    I think most people had him as the pick from DAL and it’s evidently happening.

    • Read the same. I think he would pair well with Reilly Smith and Marschesault as a 2nd or 3rd line.

      • I see them as 2nd liners in Vegas. Not Eakin but Marsch & Smith.

  21. McKenzie says Neal from NSH. Dreger says Leipsic from TOR.

  22. Emelin from MTL. I was shocked at that, at first, but he’s not as old as I thought. 31, I thought the guy was 35 for some reason.

    Emelin sounds like a flip candidate. Still think there could be a 2-3 NHL D men to DAL for #3 and an overpaid goalie type of deal.

    • Methot from OTT per LeBrun.

      • if they Flip Methot I understand why. I have to assume to TOR for picks……. I would have liked to have seen Bobby Ryan taken….helps hit the cap floor for the next few years and gives them a #1 RW.

    • I would have thought Vegas would have took Nesterov over Emelin. Hmmm… IF they flip him for a better asset then I understand why.

    • That’s who I had being selected, played 2nd pairing minutes in Mtl; less than a min of TOI/GP less per game than Markov at #3, #1 PK, 4th in the NHL for hits by Dman, solid physical stay at home Dman.

      If Smith gets you a 2nd & 3rd at last seasons trade deadline what does Emelin get you at this seasons deadline? I say more.

      In the meantime he’s there to help mentor the youth being drafted at D until the right return can be had & for UFA Dman that’s usually at the trade deadline. Give me Lovejoy; although 2 years remaining in his deal but best asset available from NJ, & Sbisa from Vancouver as well these D can be flipped at the trade deadline for a solid return as they perform a specific role & although Lovejoy & Sbisa are 5/6 guys at best they are legitimate NHL Dman & those always have value in trade.

      Who the hell is playing D in MTL next season, Weber, Petry, Davidsson & ?

    • What is Mtl giving up for them to take Emelin? Mtl would love this.

  23. I heard old phil kessel may be on the market any takers? Toronto!

  24. McKenzie saying Berube is the Islander going to Las Vegas with Grabovski and the 15th pick. Garth Snow for GM of the year??

  25. Picks leaking from all over. Reinhart, Perron, Emelin, Lindberg, Schlemko, Berube and Grabovski and 1st, Haula and Tuch and 3rd, Stoner and Montour, Clarkson and Karlsson and 1st, Engelland, TVR, McNabb, Methot, Bellemare….. Why the need to even watch tonight..lol