NHL Morning Coffee Headlines – July 13, 2024
The latest on the Rangers attempt to trade Jacob Trouba, Predators GM Barry Trotz weighs in on teams like his in “no-tax” states, and the latest signings in today’s NHL Morning Coffee Headlines.
THE HOCKEY NEWS’ Stefen Rosner cited former New York Rangers general manager Neil Smith saying team captain Jacob Trouba blocked a trade to the Detroit Red Wings when he learned that’s where the Rangers wanted to trade him.
Smith said the Rangers asked Trouba for his 15-team no-trade list before his no-movement clause changed to a modified no-trade clause on July 1. As per his contract, the Trouba camp refused until July 1. When they did submit the list, Detroit was part of it because it had already been leaked to the media that the Rangers were talking about a trade with the Red Wings.
New York Rangers defenseman Jacob Trouba (NHL Images).
That leaves Rangers management facing what Smith calls some “muddy waters” with their most important player, their team captain. He believes they’ll have to make Trouba feel wanted again.
SPECTOR’S NOTE: This was clumsily handled by Rangers management but it did provide some intrigue to this summer’s trade market. That deal with Detroit was dead once it got leaked to the press. It seems that way based on all we’ve learned since late June.
Some Rangers supporters still blame Trouba for “putting himself above the team” by invoking his no-trade clause to block the deal to Detroit. However, he did nothing wrong by abiding by the terms of his contract.
The Rangers know which teams aren’t on Trouba’s “no-trade” list. They could attempt to move him to one of those clubs this summer, or before next year’s trade deadline, or at some point next summer. His $8 million cap hit will make that difficult to pull off, but it’s not impossible.
In the meantime, both sides will have to deal with the fallout from this situation. It’ll be interesting to see how this shakes out and what effect (if any) it has on the Rangers in 2024-25.
THE SCORE: Nashville Predators GM Barry Trotz acknowledged that his team has an advantage playing in a state that doesn’t levy a state tax.
“It is an advantage because your dollar goes a little bit further,” he told TSN’s Overdrive on Wednesday. “There’s no question”.
The Predators made headlines this summer by signing unrestricted free agents Steven Stamkos, Jonathan Marchessault and Brady Skjei. Along with the Predators, the Florida Panthers, Tampa Bay Lightning, Vegas Golden Knights, Dallas Stars and Seattle Kraken also have the advantage of playing where there is no state tax.
Four of the last five Stanley Cup champions were from “no-tax” states. The Lightning won in 2020 and 2021, the Golden Knights in 2023 and the Panthers in 2024.
SPECTOR’S NOTE: Those clubs have played in “no-tax” states for years. It’s only been recently that three of them enjoyed championship success. Some observers believe this gives those teams an unfair advantage that should be addressed in the next round of collective bargaining.
The lack of a state tax does help those teams retain their best players and add players via free agency. However, it does not guarantee success. How management invests that money in building and maintaining a contender remains the determining factor.
The Predators have declined since reaching the 2017 Stanley Cup Final and winning the Presidents’ Trophy the following season. Their previous management was not renowned for making big splashes in the free-agent pool like those that Trotz just made. It remains to be seen how those moves pan out.
As for the Stars, they have had their share of ups and downs since their Stanley Cup victory 25 years ago. The Kraken have only existed since 2021-22 and are still trying to build themselves into a contender.
The Panthers were a laughingstock for over two decades until they finally brought in stable ownership and management. The Lightning endured some ownership and management turmoil following their first Stanley Cup in 2004, including a rebuilding phase directly responsible for their consecutive championships.
Meanwhile, the Golden Knights’ habit of swinging big trades for elite talent left them with a depleted prospect pipeline that could prove costly in the long run.
The salary cap eventually catches up with these clubs.
Limited cap space forced the Lightning to make cost-cutting moves that drained their roster depth, including the recent departure of Stamkos and trading away Mikhail Sergachev.
The Golden Knights recently lost Jonathan Marchessault, Chandler Stephenson, William Carrier, Michael Amadio, and Logan Thompson due to cap constraints while the Panthers had to bid farewell to defenseman Brandon Montour.
NEW YORK POST: The Rangers signed defenseman Chad Ruhwedel to a one-year, two-way contract worth $775K at the NHL level.
DAILY FACEOFF: The New York Islanders also signed forward Liam Foudy to a one-year, two-way contract.
DAILY FACEOFF: The Columbus Blue Jackets avoided arbitration with goaltender Jet Greaves, signing him to a two-year contract with an average annual value of $812,500.
SPECTOR’S NOTE: Greaves is the fourth who filed for salary arbitration to sign with his club before his arbitration hearing was scheduled. The other three were Tampa Bay Lightning defenseman J.J. Moser, San Jose Sharks blueliner Ty Emberson and Blue Jackets rearguard Jake Christiansen.
The lighting and knights played games with Long-Term Injured Reserve to get under the cap. That helped more than not having income tax.
The league needs to address that and not mess with smaller markets that have better laws.
The constant harping on tax advantages nonsense.
First of all it isn’t as big an advantage once deductions, residence, and jurisdiction is factored in.
Is a winning tradition and chance at SC or ice time on a rebuilding team.
Quality of living is a factor.
Education is a factor.
Spousal situation is a factor.
Extended family is a factor.
Hockey environment/pressure is a factor.
Weather is a factor, do you want to play a winter sport going to the rink in flip flops?
These are just a few factors, there are many more that influence a player on where he chooses to play.
The players are independently wealthy, if they manage their money well, no matter where they play.
Make no mistake about it MONEY is the deciding factor over all other issues! I would not mind going to the rink after playing 18 holes of golf instead of shoveling myself out to get to the rink!
No it’s not. Plenty of guys pass up lucrative deals offered by rebuilding teams to play for teams that have a chance to win.
So what’s your answer Sr? Make the league up of only those sites where there’s no tax and the weather is balmy all the time?
George O you must be from Canada,but the last 5 cup winners have come from Sunshine states,is that a coincidence or just a trend! Where do todays young players want to play Winnepeg,Calgary or south of the border?
So, why don’t we Canadians do the noble thing and shut down Winnipeg, Ottawa, Calgary, Edmonton, Vancouver, Toronto and Montreal and let them move the franchises to Houston, San Diego, San Francisco, Hartford, Atlanta and Kansas City?
That should shut up the self-centred elitists.
George O that s for commissioner Bettman and the players association to decide!We just saw a warm weather team relocate to the winter wonderland in Utah!
Flip flop hockey is great. Coming from Canada and living in Tampa. I can honestly say going to the rink in shorts and flip flops and warm sunshine beats snow wind and ice IMHO
Those flip-flops will soon need asbestos lining Mrbruin4
https://www.npr.org/2024/07/11/nx-s1-5034292/temperature-records-heatwave-climate-change?utm_source=pocket-newtab-en-us
It only became an issue when the Lightning, Golden Knights and Panthers won their Stanley Cups. There’s now an assumption every team in no-tax states will use it to build Cup contenders. This is one instance where the salary cap is the great leveler.
The Lightning are in decline and desperately scrambling to make moves to at least remain a playoff contender. The Golden Knights are in cap hell, which cost them core forwards Marchessault and Stephenson. The Predators have been in decline since 2018 and there’s no guarantee their big UFA signings will pay off in a championship. The Stars have done well over the past three seasons largely by shrewd management than tax advantages but even they felt the pinch when they lost Tanev to free agency. The Kraken are still going through their growing pains.
The Panthers are in good shape but cap constraints cost them Brandon Montour.
I’ll need to see a few more years of teams in “no-tax states” winning Cups before I believe this needs to be sorted out in collective bargaining.
George
There is no stopping natures cycle. Since dawn of time hot to cold then back again. I will be long gone before the thermal apocalypse
LOL. We hope! I could be long-gone too.
But crap do have a tendency to pick up speed once it gets in motion.
Don’t forget the so called allure of playing for an original 6 team. How do you get rid of that unfair advantage?
That’s a myth buried long in the past. The “Original Six” ceased to exist as such over half a Century ago – 57 years to be exact. ”
The average NHL player plays on average 4.5 years. However, when looking at the data in detail the top 25% of players played an average of 12 years, whereas the bottom 75% played an average of 2 years.” Taken from this site:
https://hockeyanswered.com/what-is-the-average-career-length-of-an-nhl-player/
Name the last player to voice the allure of playing for “an Original Six.” It is, if you can find any, in the minority since it’s ancient history to today’s generation.
You certainly don’t hear that nonsense in any of the NFL, MLB or NBA each of which have “original” franchises.
It’s not uncommon for players to express how amazing it is to play for an original 6. But you are right. It’s an outdated nhl thing. One more thing that keeps the league trailing those others.
Come on HF30.
A few weeks ago I replied to your comments on whether state tax advantage was a factor with an article from a financial magazine that showed a 30% net saving advantage on large contracts.
Pro football players were the example, and quoted players saying they planned to target non tax states in negotiations. It is a widely practised strategy.
It took me 5 minutes to find the information, and cut and paste it on this site, and when coupled with NHL GMs saying publicly it is the dominant advantage it is futile to say otherwise.
As to Lyle’s observations that the salary cap is the great leveler, true to a point. Chicago and LA both overpaid their stars after Cup wins, the common denominator being players desire to max their income.
What did Stamkos, with career earnings of $116,675,00 do? He followed the money to another non tax state when he could have stayed in Tampa.
McKinnon, Matthews or McDavid leapfrog each other each negotiation, and they and others will continue to do so.
And so would you.
Show me the money, Jerry!
LJ,
You spent time finding, cutting and pasting an article, which I didn’t bother responding to as it calls for a rather lengthy explanation and I don’t like going down rabbit holes.
Suffice it to say i will supply 1 link where Kent Hughes shares his opinion,
https://montrealgazette.com/sports/hockey/nhl/hockey-inside-out/canadiens-kent-hughes-sign-free-agents-future
In the article there is also a video clip with player agent Allan Walsh explaining ways to mitigate the tax situation.
Great article. Thanks for the link … puts things into proper perspective
What do you expect Hughes to say, HF30? He’s paid to entice players to come to Montreal.
Your cut and paste is an explanation of how the non state tax advantages can be mitigated, not eliminated.
It hardly changes the irrefutable fact about the distinct advantage non-state taxes have, irrespective of paying taxes for a small % for games played elsewhere.
LJ,
If you can mitigate the tax situation to be almost insignificant as Walsh explains, on the one hand and not worry about birth control , gun nuts, abortion, hurricanes, flooding in Florida, Texas, Tennessee, the scales would tip away for many.
The point is there are many ways to look at the situation for those players who actually have a say in where they’ll play.
There are advantages and disadvantages to these cities.
Well. That explains the need for the non taxation rates!
This might sound crazy but try this on for size! The Rangers cannot get rid of Trouba unless he agrees! His decisions are based on family decisions tied to his wife and the medical field! Would a trade with Boston make this commutable for him and his wife,satisfying his demands! So Boston trades to NY,Korpisalo,Peake,and a 3rd round pick,for Trouba and a 2 rd pick! Trouba could be a version of Carlo with more snarl!
That trade’s not happening, Sr. The Rangers already have a reliable (and more affordable) backup goalie in Jonathan Quick. They can’t afford to take on Trouba’s salary even with Korpisalo and Peeke going the other way because they still have to sign Swayman, who’s getting a big raise as their starting goalie.
Florida, Texas, and Tennessee may not have taxes but if my partners are women or similar of childbearing age I would like to go somewhere else.
There is that 12th Century, Bible-thumping mentality to consider for sure, Laura.
Bruins no want a 8miion dollar 3rd pair d man. Their d is pretty solid
Predicated the basis of a trade because Trouba has them over a barrel for 2 more years and they seem desperate to find a trade partner! Location is the major roadblock!Boston would have to add one small piece if money is still a stumbling block!NY could flip Korpisalo if they want! Insurance against Shesterkins soon to be salary demands!
Keep telling yourself that, Sr. It’s not happening because of the reasons I mentioned in my earlier post.
Lyle,just a random thought for discussion seeing that Trouba and Drury now have a very awkward relationship!
No disagreement regarding the relationship between Trouba and Drury. I’m just suggesting you come up with more realistic trade scenarios than that Bruins one.
Especially after they just relinquished a Grade A goalie for an albatross contract, a marginal 4th line C and their own late 1st round pick.
I do not like the way Trouba plays, however, he has effectively delivered a shockingly clean check to Drury’s attempt to trade him. Good for him. He signed the contract he signed and isn’t circumventing anything by nixing a trade (putting Detroit on his no trade list after details were leaked). He isn’t going anywhere…because he doesn’t want to.
Boy, I am overwhelmed with what Waddell has done with the Blue Jackets. Still, no coach just signed Jet Greaves for 2 years first year is 2-way of course. Other than overpaying Monahan he has been very frugal with the money. The team is in worse shape than it was. But we have Elvis.
Fred Haefer,what has Carolina done since his absence? Lost Skjel,Guentzel, Noesen, Terravanian Necas wants out ,Pesce, he left a sinking ship!
The Rangers are done. Chris Drury destroyed the team chemistry. Think about it, if your Alexis Lafreniere, do you sign a long term contract to play for a GM that is so underhanded and conniving.
Drury will undercut his veterans and even his team Captain. Honestly, if you’re a UFA, would you play for this guy.
His inadequacy will turn a Presidents Trophy team into a team that will not even qualify for the playoffs next season.
Fire Drury today!
As an “Anti-Rangers” person, I hope he stays and Hextall’s up the whole team.
Still don’t know why the Canadian dollar isn’t mentioned as a factor in free agent decisions.
Players are paid in US dollars, cost of living in Canadian cities is in Canadian dollars.
Would that not be advantageous to a player’s bottom line?
By the way, we haven’t had an “old fashioned” winter where I live for years and years. Outdoor skating rinks need to be artificial ice; otherwise they may not open at all during the winter.
But, hey, the NHL is moving toward a July Cup final so who cares?
You can point out as many factors as you want that are more influential than being a tax free state and shared by all 32 teams.
And yes advantages are no guarantee of success. However that doesn’t mean it isn’t an advantage and a significant one at that.
Like less media scrutiny, preferred climate, quality of current roster. All these are advantages to some degree or other when it comes to attracting talent to your roster.