Sunday NHL Rumor Roundup – September 20, 2020
Possible free-agent destinations for Alex Pietrangelo, plus the latest on the Islanders and Canadiens in the Sunday NHL Rumor Roundup.
WHERE COULD PIETRANGELO GO VIA FREE AGENCY?
THE SCORE: Joel Wegman listed the Toronto Maple Leafs, Boston Bruins, Colorado Avalanche, Calgary Flames, and Edmonton Oilers as possible destinations for St. Louis Blues defenseman Alex Pietrangelo if he hits the open market next month. Contract talks between Pietrangelo and the Blues broke off last week as the club advised him to pursue free agency.
Wegman acknowledged the salary-cap constraints of the Leafs and Oilers mean they’d have to shed a salary or two to sign Pietrangelo. The Bruins’ logical need is for a scorer (Wegman suggests Arizona’s Taylor Hall) but he doesn’t rule out general manager Don Sweeney signing Pietrangelo and shopping Brandon Carlo or Connor Clifton for a left-side defenseman.
The Flames would have to overpay but they have $17 million in salary-cap room. The Avalanche have plenty of cap room and Wegman suggests they could shop Ian Cole and Erik Johnson to make room for Pietrangelo and create long-term cap space to re-sign Cale Makar and Gabriel Landeskog.
SPECTOR’S NOTE: Some interesting suggestions from Wegman. The Leafs have been tied to Pietrangelo in the rumor mill for months. Signing him, however, requires some nifty salary-cap gymnastics by Leafs GM Kyle Dubas, which could include acquiring a player on permanent LTIR to allow them to spend over the cap ceiling.
The Oilers must improve their goaltending and add a reliable right-wing scorer. I don’t think they’ll get into the Pietrangelo sweepstakes. The Flames could try but GM Brad Treliving could be reluctant to overpay for his services.
Boston and Colorado are the intriguing ones on this list. Perhaps Sweeney gets creative as Wegman suggests, but the Avs’ Joe Sakic seems in prime position to strike. I think he should pursue an experienced starting goalie, but Pietrangelo could be that missing piece of the championship puzzle.
WHAT NEXT FOR THE ISLANDERS?
NEW YORK POST: Mollie Walker looked at the roster issues facing the New York Islanders next season. She expects UFA goalie Thomas Greiss will be replaced by promising Ilya Sorokin. UFA defenseman Andy Greene and winger Matt Martin might have to take pay cuts to stay with the Isles. Forward Derick Brassard was a healthy scratch at times during the postseason.
Center Mathew Barzal and defensemen Devon Toews and Ryan Pulock are restricted free agents. GM Lou Lamoriello said earlier this year he’d match any offer sheet for Barzal and it isn’t his intention to allow negotiations to reach that point.
NEWSDAY: Andrew Gross believes the Islanders need a top-six scorer or two who can improve their power play. Winnipeg Jets winger Patrik Laine, Florida Panthers winger Mike Hoffman, or Arizona’s Taylor Hall could be good initial targets.
SPECTOR’S NOTE: Cap Friendly indicates the Islanders have $72.5 million invested in 20 players. Barzal’s new contract will eat up most of that remaining $8.9 million even if he agreed to an affordable bridge deal. GM Lou Lamoriello will have to shed salary just to re-sign Barzal, Toews and Pulock, which could mean bidding farewell to Martin, Greene and Brassard.
Lamoriello could get creative to add a scoring forward. However, I don’t see him being able to acquire a sniper such as Laine or sign an expensive UFA winger like Hall or Hoffman.
LATEST CANADIENS SPECULATION
TVA SPORTS: noted Montreal Canadiens GM Marc Bergevin recently said he’s interested in landing a big forward who can help his club’s offensive attack. The site listed Chicago’s Brandon Saad, Detroit’s Anthony Mantha, Columbus’ Josh Anderson, Carolina’s Nino Niedereitter, Minnesota’s Jordan Greenway and Edmonton’s Jesse Puljujarvi as power forwards who might be enticing to Bergevin.
SPECTOR’S NOTE: The Blackhawks must shed salary to re-sign RFAs Dominik Kubalik and Dylan Strome as well as re-sign or replace UFA goalie Corey Crawford. They could move Saad and his $6 million cap hit for next season but could be reluctant to go that route unless they get a more affordable replacement. Some Habs fans might suggest Max Domi, but the Blackhawks are set at center with Jonathan Toews, Kirby Dach and Dylan Strome, and might not see Domi as an effective substitution for Saad.
Anderson has potential but his season-ending shoulder injury could be cause for concern. Niederreiter tends to be inconsistent and at $5.25-million annually for the next two seasons would be an expensive gamble.
Puljujarvi has proven nothing yet at the NHL level. Unless the Oilers are willing to dump him for a song, Bergevin should consider more established options. I don’t believe Mantha or Greenway are available.
I would love to see Pietro on the D in Calgary next year. Would certainly provide a shake up and take some pressure off Gio. Not overly sure about the owners financial situation there but assuming they can spend to the cap if justified. With reported offers from STL not exceeding 8, I wonder if Calgary comes in at the high 8’s, even 9 if it gets done. Give him the structure he wants but at that $$, would prefer to see a 5 year.
SCJ, hard to know about the ownership financial situation and who owns what portion. Murray Edwards is Chairman so I am guessing has the biggest share.
He is majority owner Canadian Natural Resources, or that is his biggest holding, and they are struggling like most Oil Sands companies.
Net loss in first 6 months of 2020 is $1.59 Billion. Really big #.
CNRL has made billions over the years and I am guessing Mr. Edwards has as well and the Flames are a small part of his holdings, but he also isn’t in the business of losing money without doing something about it either.
So ya, who knows what they decide to do.
The other owners are in Energy, Real Estate and Transport. None of which are thriving but that is true for everything other than Tech.
I think they spend to the cap or close.
I was disappointed to read in the Athletic of a strained relationship between Pietrangelo and Armstrong. The issues appear to go beyond the contract impasse. It certainly would make a last minute contract extension even less likely. It sounds as though Armstong is real difficult to deal with in negotiations, although I IN NO WAY would support caving in on $s/term etc. Makes me wonder if going to Colorado would be Petro’s 1st option to “stick it to the Blues”—I don’t like thinking that way.
I read that as well. Sounded like they were there on the $$ and term but the structure (probably mid-loaded, NMC, and salary bonuses at the end). STL has no NMC’s which I hadn’t realized.
Problem Amrstrong created when he traded for Faulk and signed him to that contract leaving less room to sign Petri to a GOOD contract for both sides….now they have to “cap limit” the offer. This was compounded more with COVID
Martha would look good in a Habs uniform. It would take a lot. ..
Domi Mete Caufield . Maybe even a pick on top
Players should expect 30-40% less than they would have got this time last year. Short term contract would be the answer. Pietrangelo insulted by $7m but he shouldn’t be .The new fiscal reality .
No fans and then some fans as the season continues .
I’d love Mantha but not at the cost of Domi, Mete and Caufield. Much too much. I keep Caufield. Mantha is a big and talented winger but he never reached 50 pts and is often hurt. Domi is a center who reached 72 pts and was on a 50 pts paste in a bad season. Domi straight ahead for Mantha is fair. Domi and Mete would be my absolute limit. If more, let’s get Saad for one season. Hawks need to shed salary
There is zero interest in Detroit for either Domi or Mete. Domi was demoted to the 4th line against Philadelphia, and Mete played about 12 minutes in game 6 – 3rd pair minutes. Neither would be acceptable as part of a package for Mantha. Caulfield + 1st round pick + ???? – maybe.
Iago, if the asking price was Caufield and a first, what makes you think the Canadiens would do that ? What benefit would they get ? Better be patient with Caufield who might become a better goal scorer than Mantha and draft a big RW with the pick. +If you don’t think that people should judge Domi on his 72 points season, don’t judge him on one ”bad” 50 points season..
The only reason he played on the 4th is because he wanted to play center and the Habs were already full at that position. But still yet he was on a 50 points pace.. Not bad
+ Bergevin explained that he didn’t count him out, that the difference this year was that he was putting skill in front of grind or power as last year it was the opposite
Wow too much!!! Mete isn’t an NHl player, Domi is border line top 6 and Caufield hasn’t played in the NHL and plus he is a midget for Mantha…if you want Mantha maybe a first and an NHL ready player Kotkaniemi.
Mike Pilon – The Canadiens would do that trade in a heartbeat for several reasons. First, they would get a proven scorer who can help next year. Caulfield may not pan out, and if he does, it may be another 2 or 3 years before he does. Same thing with the pick – 3 to 5 years before he is probably ready to contribute, if ever. And then there is the size thing. Montreal is small – as is Detroit – and Mantha is 10″ taller than Caulfield, and outweighs him by what – 50 / 60 lbs. ? As for Domi at center on the 4th line – why was he there at all ? The Canadiens were desperate to score against Philly, but found 3 other centers better ? Where do you think he would play here ? Center, of course – if he were good enough to beat out at least one of Montreal’s other centers in their desperate quest to score goals.
Mantha isn’t worth near that, he has only ever had 2 seasons with 24-25 goals and has had injuries every year
bigbadbruins – Boston would go after Mantha quickly if he were available. They need size up front, to get younger, and depth scoring. Mantha checks all 3 boxes. But I really don’t think the Wings are interested in moving him anyway.
Iago you say he is a proven goal scorer and only hit the twenties twice? How do you say he is worth that much?
bigbadbruins – Well, we have a tough time scoring here in Detroit. We get almost nothing from our defense (which is weak), and often spend way too much time in our own zone. With even a moderately talented team, with a little playmaking from the back end, Mantha is a 35 – 40 goal man.
That’s a lot of “ ifs” for giving up that much
I don’t think it’s so much that he’s I silted at the offer but they’ve offered $7.7M with no description of how the contract is structured.
If you were signing what would likely be your last big contract of your career wouldn’t you like to know the details beforehand?
How many years is the contract? Are there bonuses? How much and when are they paid? Some contracts are buyout/lockout proof where they’re mostly paid in bonus money with lower annual salary. This also helps their bottom line with regards to taxes. He’s being asked to take a discount which would make him more tradeable so a NMC wouldn’t be out of line.
Lots of details that any player would want to know before signing on the dotted line.
This is where TOR can offer the AAV and the bonus structure that STL might be unwilling to.
I’m not saying TOR should pursue Pietrangelo. I think they would be better off trying to trade for a RHD that is within the age of their core like Pesce. Signing DeMelo as a UFA wouldn’t be a bad plan either.
It will be interesting how this plays out.
Lago…bbb is habs fan. He has issues with his identity, ask bigbear!
Domi has a ppg of .669
Mantha has a ppg of .665
Domi is more durable 375 games vs Mantha at 260 games and they have almost identical ppg.
Domi also more versatile as he can play wing or center and we all know centers are more valuable.
Inclusion Domi for Mantha is very fair and maybe a little bit more in favor of Detroit.
So before you start spitting out opinions on trades you should do little research
Domi’s stats are nearly identical to those of Kevin Hayse.
Domi should fetch a late first round pick.
I’d keep him because he has the potential to be like Marchand, and Claude knows it. He just needs to buy into the 200′ game.
All this talk about Detroit moving Mantha, is the same fabricated media BS as the Jets moving Laine.
I agree with you Uwey. And the Habs fans here seem to think they can get him for a few spare parts and a back of pucks.
As a no have fan they may be undervaluing mantha but you are waaaayyyy overvaluing him.
Ok I get it Iago, you don’t like Habs or their fans too much and that’s quite ok, but some people were just spitballing, no reason to make fun of them. It’s not like if they throw something out there and that it is going to happen..
I know the Wings have been very interested in Petry for quite a while, so if a trade had to happen, it might be totally different from what we think.
Anyways, why would the Wings trade Mantha in the first place.
You’re so right. Folks just suggest these random players (of value), & argue about it. Then they inflate the value of the guys they’d like to unload? i laugh at so many of these “trade” scenarios Especially the multi player trades. Or, how they desperately want to unload a player (on their team) & we’ll give you him, as a throw in. And how they “justify” the exchange.
Mike – you are right on several scores. First, I am a Red Wings homer fan for 55+ years. As far as other fans, I respect the honest ones who admit the reality of their players limits and value. And you are right – I don’t think the Wings are going to move Mantha – unless it was an overwhelming offer, which is not likely to happen. As for Petry, well, the Wings are going nowhere next year, so, rather than trade for him, and since he is a UFA after 20/21, I would simply wait and sign him then. He grew up here, and I think his family lives here, and he might welcome the trip home.
Chisms – Just trying to drive up the price – LOL ! Honestly, I don’t think the Wings will move Mantha. As you may have noticed, we are a little short on talent here, and can’t afford to trade value for value. If GMSY did think of moving him, it would have to be a trade where we received perceived greater value than we gave up, and that is unlikely.
But I am a Habs fan, as diehard as they come!!!
That said, as per the Claude Julien season review interview, it is not so much Max Domi wanting to play center, as it is Julien & the coaching staff feeling they can the most out of Max as a centerman. Julien also said he had no issues with having five very competent centerman on the roster. Being able to roll four lines in any given situation he felt was a huge advantage. Every player, every line has it’s ups & downs throughout a long season, so having the kind of depth the Habs have at center now is a great problem to have. Also he added that injuries are very much a part of the game which can dictate a teams season without strong depth.
He said that when he spoke to Max at their year end meeting, he told him the biggest difference between the last two seasons was that Max two years ago looked to take the shot on net when he had it, but last season Max seemed to revert back to make a pass, sometimes even when he had a far look at the net himself. He said Max needed to get back to shooting more.
So IMHO, it sounds like the team is more than willing to move forward with both Danault & Domi in the lineup as well a fifth center in Jake Evans.
Depth is a blessing not not curse.
SilverSevin. I’d agree with you there. Have to think Pietrangelo wants to stay and money wasn’t issue. If he’s committed to keeping his family in St. Louis, that having nmc is most important
Silver. If you look at Brodin extension that doesn’t kick in until next year. 6m AAV. Only 4m in 1st year, then 5m the next. After that it jumps to 8M. That’s the reality. Pietrangelo will get 8-9m a year. It’ll just be structured so the actual $ paid out each year are inline with expectation that fans will be back in a year or 2
Detroit doesn’t want Domi or Mete, If we want a Domi clone we’ll just draft Marco Rossi. Mete is meh no thanks we don’t need him. Detroit’s not in any position to deal Mantha he’s only only legit scoring winger. We can do better then adding Domi as our 2C and pay him as much as Mantha. Yzerman will want a boatload for Mantha and Bergevin wont pay it.
LEAFS – ( sorry ) lol
After watching the playoffs this year… sure a steady defense is important ..and Headman is by far above and beyond an elite D man ..however in my viewing I see size on the wings in the top 6 and a big 3rd line Center to be more of lasting importance.
I feel the Leafs need to improve here first before they go all out on Petro with an $ 8 – $ 9 million price tag for term..that money can be spent on POSSIBLY 2 players that can actually improve the style of play up front…
Kerfoot Johanson and Nylander have to go
its a combined $ 14 million that could really be used to get bigger and harder to play against !
These players get pushed off the puck way to much ..yes they have speed but in a playoff series they have no way to win cycle games and cause turnovers due to lack of size..and Iam quite sick and tired of the William Nylander BUTTON HOOK play on zone entries …EVERY SINGLE TIME he crosses the blue line ..most of his goals were goal scrum deposits this year …they all need to be upgraded
…of the final 6 – 8 teams that made it that far ..I dont see the Leafs being able to match anyone of those teams play and intensity or even get out of the first round the way this team is built.
You want a right shot D man ..who plays good in his own Zone 2o minutes a night but the teaching philosophy of this team is puck possession in the offensive zone so why pay a D man who is 30
$8 plus million if that is the case …
Freddie faced more shots then most any other goalie over the past 5 years with the puck possession fast little skaters philosophy so how has that worked out for ya…LMAO.
Save the money on Petro get Ristolainen, Manson, Dumba Nurse and save the money and make DEALS… instead to upgrade & up-size the wings in top 6 and get a BIG 3rd line grinder Center ….
make a deal with the Vegas Knights to get
M A Fleury have them hold $2 million in the deal …this should be top priority instead ….IMO …
Wishful thinking …LOL
Take care… have a good day …Cheers
Hi Kal El
I’ve been wanting Nurse as a Leaf for a long time… big fan
But he’s LD… Leafs already have Reilly and Muzzin
Like Manson but only 1 year left
Dumba 👍👍👍👍
Risto I’m not too keen on; I’d much much rather have Montour if they are trading with Sabres (a rarity)
See my post re VGKs… if Knights do move him ( after this year’s playoffs who knows? Statsny should be moved anyway)… I’m hoping it’s not Leafs or Pens
Pengy..you think jared McCann stays with the 2 year extension at $2.94 million or now gets moved..since teams know he isnt a rfa.. 8 think he is getting moved..
agree with you Kal
Well said kal and you got the 3 targeted that I would move as well.
Kal-el. Your sign off suggests you are on your way somewhere. I hope it is to the eye Dr. Nylander “button hooked” his way to 30 goals in a shortened season. You are damaging your credibility with comments like that.
Don’t let something like stats or facts confuse you. It’s common knowledge that Nylander is a peripheral player and does not score the majority of his goals in the dirty area, puck carriers are turn over machines and all this for a 23yr old for under $7m cap hit.
He’s a bum!
Ron don’t forget how one dimensional he is maybe the most one dimensional guy in the league
Your credibility doesn’t exist Wendell . I wouldn’t point to others .
You keep thinking that you and you alone have it straight though lol . Can’t even get any support from the leaf fans on this page , let alone anyone outside the blue nation . They got 1 goal from the “depth” forwards in the play in and you want to eliminate all other depth to sign petro and any goalie with a pulse to replace Fred . Are you James tanner by chance ?
Ron. The vast majority of Nylanders goals were scored from within 5 ft of the net. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Common knowledge = can’t see or think for yourself in your case. Just regurgitating garbage from others without facts. And is he had gotten that many goals from the periphery he would be the best talent in the league.
Wendel, Ron Moore was being sarcastic.
Please try to keep up if you feel that you must add to the discussion.
For what it’s worth, Paul Higgins was a speed bag who couldn’t fight or skate.
Well said, I like Dumba for Nylander plus picks or Nylander & Kerfoot
I think that you Leafs fans are over valuing Nylander.
I believe the consensus around the NHL is that if you take him off the team that has Matthews, Marner and Tavares he is not as effective.
Tavares alone made Okposo, Moulson, Parenteau and Boyes millionaires.
How are all those guys doing without JT?
3 are out of the league and Okposo has been a disappointment in Buffalo, to say the least.
I think that the brain trust in the NHL sees Nylander for what he is. A top 6t player with inflated numbers, because of who he plays with.
No one is taking him at his Cap Hit.
The idea that Dufus can unload any of his bloated contracts is ludicrous.
First, JT has an absolute NO MOVEMENT clause.
He didn’t leave the Island to be traded later from his hometown. Not happening.
Matthews is the one player who will exceed his contract. I loved what I saw from him in the play in round. The light bulb has gone off in his head.
I predict that Matthews will win the Hart next year. I saw him grow up before my eyes. AM now knows what it takes to win. Hunger over talent. He now has both.
Marner. Too much money for any team to take on, in this time of doubt. Excellent player. Not his fault that the Leafs over value him. Would any other team pay him that much against the cap? Short answer, No.
The only way the Leafs land Petro is if they overpay for him. So, add in his 8, 9 or 10 million and you have 5 players making 5/8 ths of the Cap.
Not happening, Leaf fans.
i still say Nylander & #15 for Ekblad to pair with Muzzin as their TOP D pair.
Johanssen and something to BUF for RISTO to pair with Reilly
There’s been Carlo & DeBrusk trade talks going on in Boston and it would make sense for Bruins to sign a UFA Dman in order to trade Carlo & DeBrusk in a package for a winger with size who can score …..Sweeney & Neely have said the Bruins need to get size & toughness without sacrificing much speed it seems they want to do a mini rebuild
Joe, I’ve been reading the same thing.
I don’t get the talk of Carlo being moved. The Covid Cup I wouldnt judge anybody play based on that. Carlo absolutely dominated during the playoffs last year. You don’t move a strong 6’5″ Dman who can skate.
Moving Carlo creates an unnecessary hole and furthermore if his offense doesn’t pick up he won’t be expensive to resign.
Debrusk is streaky and tentative if the right deal like Virtanen is there then yes.
Boston is in a good situation cap wise and with today’s economics they might be able to add some good pieces. Moving Carlo should not be part of this.
Joe
I think Bruins would be foolish to move Carlo
I see a big future for this lad
Bruins certainly do not need to rebuild
They lost to a team that is a SC finalist; and if they play like they can (they didn’t last night)…. will be SC champs
Keep Carlo
I agree Pengy. The Bruins would be wise to keep Carlo. If they decided to move him, bring him to the Wings – please !
Trading Carlo and Debrusk to sign a forward who can score and a UFA’s defenseman doesn’t make sense that’s what they are. They need to sign a Left defenseman best available who can defend. Give Vaakanienen and Zboril a chance. Sign a RW like Hoffman. Unless they sign Hall then move Debrusk for a left defenseman.
AP would look great in Boston; howecer, if I’m AP and Colarado comes calling, it be hard not to pick them.
Boston has a short window, the Avalanche window is wide open. AP could be the difference maker.
I wonder though if Sakic would finally give out that huge contract and make AP his highest paid player. Makar is going to need a contract next year and if he progresses further, I wouldn’t be surprised if handing out a big number this year sets a precedent as we saw in Toronto with their forwards.
Hi SCJ
can’t see Joe going “all in “ to acquire Petro
Avs are on the rise and will be contenders for cup for 3 or 4 years even w/o Petro
Makar is their heir apparent on RHD
No matter what Petro would get in Colorado; Makaar will eventually get more; MacK substantially more…. so acquiring Petro now just boosts payroll due to “extra” raises for others down the road
Petro also not an Av IMHO unless Johnston is moved
Pengy that’s exactly why Joe Sakic goes and gets AP because they do have a 4 or 5 year window.
Worry about next year cap hit next year.
I don’t think the 17 million cap space is going to go as far as people think, considering they have to sign 4 forwards with Mangiapane getting a significant raise, 2 to 3 defensemen and a decent goalie for once.. unless they trade dollar for dollar to fill a couple spots I don’t se Petro being affordable for them…
Calgary that is…
Calgary that is.
Nomad, you are absolutely correct. It is for that reason that I do not think taking a run at Hall is smart, but I’d spend that for AP. In the Score article where it was suggested they round out Calgary’s defense with Valimaki and Kylington.
To make a move on AP would mean rounding out the bottom with ELC’s, but there are guys like Gawdin who cam replace a Jankowski at half the price.
I wonder if Holland would want to would be interested in dealing with Bergevin to move not only Jesse Puljujarvi, but Andreas Athanasiou as well.
Being the old armchair GM for the Habs that I am, I would call Ken Holland & lay this on the table to him;
Puljujarvi & Athanasiou for Habs prospect Jesse Ylonen, Chicago’s 2020 2nd rder, Anaheim’s 2020 4th rder & conditional picks, a) a 2021 5th rder, if “one of” play top 9 forward minutes during the 20/21 season, b) a 2021 4th rder, if “both” play top 12 forward minutes during the 20/21 season or c) a 2021 3rd rder, if “both” play top 9 forward minutes during the 20/21 season.
*Ken Holland laughs & hangs up*
OR go balls to the wall
To EMD: Danault & Domi & Hudon
To MTL: RNH, AA & PJ
Re Petro
Would be a great add to any team… the cap hit is the problem.
I have no issue with his value in the $8.5 – $9 M range..term can and will be problematic to some
If he moves on from the current reigning SC champs; he’ll want to go on to a contender
With the recent very poor playoffs by Schmidt…. perhaps Vegas for Petro? Of course this first means moving Schmidt… but if they could…I’m sure Knights would jump at ponying up an extra $700 Kin cap to get Petro over Schmidt (only 1 year younger than Petro)
Schmidt cap ~ $7M
Setting aside Escrow…. $7.7 M in Vegas and $8.7 M in St L has basically the same take home pay (using Gavin group calculator…. both net around $4.9 M)
From what the media has been stating; some of the sticking points (with Army) are No Movement Clauses and Signing Bonuses.
Knights have the capacity to provide both
Knights could go $1M * 7 (Sal) ; with $47 M in signing bonuses spread out. If I understand what TSN said re escrow properly… escrow only on Sal…. so potentially under the above proposal from Knights; in 20/21 the max take home he’d lose due to escrow would be less than $115K. Army probably talking much more Sal than signing bonus; let’s say $4M was proposed Sal for next year…so max escrow could have Petro out more than 410 K in take home in St Louis
Yes…. $’s is not everything; and yes preference would not to be uprooted…. but there are likely offers that Army just can’t compete with
Just to compare… if he decides to move on…. using the same Cap hit and same signing bonus Structure… $7.7 M Gross; has net take home in Vegas; Nash; Dallas and both Florida teams is just a hair shy of $4.9 M ; to get $4.9 M take home in Toronto, Ottawa, Montreal the gross would need to be $10.43 M (using Gavin Group calculator)
Of course that also means Knights would need to get a taker for Schmidt and hope other GMs in the hunt for a RHD were not watching the Knight’s playoff games closely
Will be interesting
Up until a week ago I was basically 90% convinced he would stay a Blue…. that percentage for me is now rapidly dropping
Him to Leafs would be nice.. but not happening without moving one of top 4 or ; at least 3 other players (who then also have to be replaced)
Using the acquisition of a big LTIR only works if you have players of your own that can be sent down and/or ones that are also on LTIR that get you under cap (including the proposed acquisition of a big LTIR) as at day 1 of season… last year Leafs started the season with two players of their own on LTIR that made it work… so Petro in Blue & White is a long shot
Pengy….
to NJ: Petriengelo UFA rights (provided he will sign with NJ) & Tarasenko
to STL : Van 2020 1st, Islander 2nd & Zacha
then trade Subban for whatever…. preferably picks to flip for young players with actual upside.
Re Petro
Would be a great add to any team… the cap hit is the problem.
I have no issue with his value in the $8.5 – $9 M range..term can and will be problematic to some
If he moves on from the current reigning SC champs; he’ll want to go on to a contender
With the recent very poor playoffs by Schmidt…. perhaps Vegas for Petro? Of course this first means moving Schmidt… but if they could…I’m sure Knights would jump at ponying up an extra $700 Kin cap to get Petro over Schmidt (only 1 year younger than Petro)
Schmidt cap ~ $7M
Setting aside Escrow…. $7.7 M in Vegas and $8.7 M in St L has basically the same take home pay (using Gavin group calculator…. both net around $4.9 M)
From what the media has been stating; some of the sticking points (with Army) are No Movement Clauses and Signing Bonuses.
Knights have the capacity to provide both
Knights could go $1M * 7 (Sal) ; with $47 M in signing bonuses spread out. If I understand what TSN said re escrow properly… escrow only on Sal…. so potentially under the above proposal from Knights; in 20/21 the max take home he’d lose due to escrow would be less than $115K. Army probably talking much more Sal than signing bonus; let’s say $4M was proposed Sal for next year…so max escrow could have Petro out more than 410 K in take home in St Louis
Yes…. $’s is not everything; and yes preference would not to be uprooted…. but there are likely offers that Army just can’t compete with
Just to compare… if he decides to move on…. using the same Cap hit and same signing bonus Structure… $7.7 M Gross; has net take home in Vegas; Nash; Dallas and both Florida teams is just a hair shy of $4.9 M ; to get $4.9 M take home in Toronto, Ottawa, Montreal the gross would need to be $10.43 M (using Gavin Group calculator)
Of course that also means Knights would need to get a taker for Schmidt and hope other GMs in the hunt for a RHD were not watching the Knight’s playoff games closely
Will be interesting
Up until a week ago I was basically 90% convinced he would stay a Blue…. that percentage for me is now rapidly dropping
Him to Leafs would be nice.. but not happening without moving one of top 4 or ; at least 3 other players (who then also have to be replaced)
Using the acquisition of a big LTIR only works if you have players of your own that can be sent down and/or ones that are also on LTIR that get you under cap (including the proposed acquisition of a big LTIR) as at day 1 of season… last year Leafs started the season with two players of their own on LTIR that made it work… so Petro in Blue & White is a long shot
I had to laugh when I saw Puljujarvi mentioned as a power forward! Then all was right with the world again when Lyle mentioned that he hasn’t proved anything yet.
Hi Pengy, I am curious where people here place Petro on the list of top d-men.
Is he in the top 5?
Top 10?
Lower?
I just don’t see him as being worth anything over 8 million and that’s stretching it. If it was a normal year, then maybe.
He’s never won a Norris and isn’t even in the final 3. I did see that he came in 4 th in some places.
But is he really the 4 th best D Man in the league?
Not in my opinion, but you might feel differently.
I see 2 players in the Cup final that are better than him. Hedmann and Heiskanen are both better than him.
Not only that, but he will be 31 in January and has plenty of miles on that body.
One of the GM’s will pay the ransom and
My guess is that this years FA’s will lose about 20% of what they would have been offered without the virus. These players and agents better wake up and smell the coffee.
The days of teams handing out 10 million dollar contract is over for the foreseeable future.
Since I appear to be the only Isles fan here let me give you my take on Mollie’s view.
I think that Ladd, Boychuck and Leddy are all goners. Ladd to LTIR, Boychuck bought out or traded and Leddy will be traded. Noah Dobson is ready and will slot in for Leddy.
Martin will resign for cheap. Brassard will move along. Leo K is on the fringe and Thomas Griess will play in another city next season.
Lou will surprise people and ADD a scoring winger.
Hello, Mike Hoffman.
AP will be a Leaf. The only scenario where he wouldn’t be is if they can trade for Ekblad. One or the other will be on top pair next year. The Leafs have no problems making space because they don’t have any players will bad contracts they can’t move. You are only in cap trouble if you can’t move someone out with ease and the Leafs don’t have any of those.
Again posters should stop wasting time suggesting any of the core 4 forwards will be moved. They wont and shouldn’t be. You win with difference makers so get as many as you can. That is why AP or Ekblad alone is better than 2 guys like manson, tanev etc. That is also why Dubas will trade Andersen as he is a negative difference maker and has lost the teams confidence.
You should probably head on back to your Buzz page, guy.
Talk about negative value credibility.
Yes you win with difference makers, but you have to have them throughout the line-up, not just on your top two lines. Check what happened with the Bruins?
If you have to put those difference makers on the ice for most of the game, just to make something happen, you will still get steamrolled. Connor and Leon alone won’t win anything for the Oilers if they don’t have 3rd and 4th lines that can be trusted to spot them off once in a while.
When Stamkos and Point are both hurt, Tampa has Cirelli and Johnson to step in…. if Matthews and or/Tavares get hurt… you gonna trust Kerfoot to rise to the occasion?
Well replied. Even the absolute best defenseman can only be on the ice for 25 minutes.
Third pair guys play 10-12 per night. So do most 3rd liners.
A team needs to be just that in this sport, a team. Tampa is where they are because they can have their third line out and not worry.
You are James tanner , I know it , or at the very least a dedicated supporter . Why didn’t boy Dubas see this when Fred was 0-8 ? Did he need that extra L to move on a replacement ? Or as most sane humans , did he not see Fred as the problem ? And as I mentioned before , Fred looked fine in Anaheim , his playoff record is 17-9 with a couple rounds won prior to trade to shinny team . You didn’t answer that last time ? Nor did any leaf fans support your thoughts lol that’s almost hard to not gain blue traction
James was fun. I miss him. Rip.
So if what youre saying is accurate and you “win” with difference makers (your words, not mine) then what do you call your boys Tavares, Marner, Mathews and Nylander?
2020 – missed playoffs
2019 – out in first round
2018 – out in first round
2017 – out in first round
so with all the non winning going on in Toronto doesnt that make your “difference makers” non winners?
Or more accurately……. losers?
Your words….. not mine.
Pond hockey has never and will never succeed when the Mens Tournament begins.
Enjoy your difference makers.
This comment is about advance time surrounding contracts.
I can’t believe that multi million dollar contracts negotiations are not started long before we outsiders think. St Louis signed both Scandella and Faulk a long time ago. Knowledge aforethought regarding Pietrangelo potential problems. What was known behind the scenes.
I think this applies to many contracts. These players and their agents and management too are working before trades and signings. Eric Staal apparently turned down 5 trades in the last 18 months. And we learn about it this week.
St Louis would not even discuss terms with their Captain. Something up has been for a long time Any guesses what it might be,
Why would anyone want to play for the Leafs?? When the come on the ice they should play the music from MR Softie the ice cream truck. They are a joke no hitters and spoiled over paid players Matthews will jump from their asap . Taveras skates in slow motion and he is another year older say it with me 1967 1967 1967. Yeah the quefs.Bring back Dave Keon lmao,
Whatever, Pete.
Since the story broke about Pietrangelo’s contract talks, I’ve been reading Leaf blogs and their proposals to find a way to bring him to Toronto. The basic theme is that Toronto would load up the 3rd and 4th lines with minimum salary forwards and would do the same with the 3rd defence pair.
A couple of proposals included replacing Freddie Andersen with a goalie tandem of Campbell and another inexpensive guy.
I guess it’s possible but there are 30 other teams looking to add solid players at a discount price.
Surely it makes more sense to add two mid-level right defence men and spend to the cap to complete the forward lines.
Colorado makes a lot of sense for Pietrangelo but they have big contracts coming. I could see Boston going hard after him but we’ll see.
Not sure what you are proposing, BC, but Brian Burke broke out the difference in tax rates between the US and Toronto. (see Sportsnet). He said when he was with the Leafs they added a million to what they would otherwise offer to make up for the difference in take home pay due to the tax difference.
Wendel is convinced that Pieterangelo is going to become a Leaf. For that to happen a cap constrained team will have to pay more than US competitors.
The Leafs have already moved out a good bottom 6 guy in Kappanen, and would have to move out other good role guys as well – Johnnson? Andersen? Who else?
The Leafs would go from being a team heavy on O and light on D to a team that is out of balance in another way: top 6 forwards/top 3 D and bargain basement bottom 6 forwards/D. Is that a configuration that can go through an 82 game season and 4 rounds of playoffs, playing your top two configurations to death to be competitive?
And they still have Mikheyev to sign. Again, as a Habs fan I would love it if the Leafs found an new way to knee cap themselves … but really???
LJ. burke wasn’t smart enough to do the front loading bonus structure dubas uses which gets the bulk of the money in players hans early so they can invest and minimize the impact. Also they have more trade value later when the salary is way lower than the cap hit. They can get AP for 8.5 to 8.75 with this front load.
In my humble opinion, I would hope that if the Leafs pursued Pietroangelo they divest themselves of one of their higher-priced forwards instead of getting rid of their goaltending and depth. It’s great to have flashy stars, but depth and goaltending win in the playoffs. As a Leafs fan, I would much rather see them go for a more affordable right-D option or two and add to their 3rd/4th line depth instead of signing someone to $9million +.
Pete, because TML is all that really matters with slight apologies to Montreal. it is a tough thing for the haters to accept I know but the day after one of the remaining who cares teams win the cup all that will generate traffic is what the Leafs afe going to do with draft picks, goalie changes and trades. Don’t let it eat you up, its just how it is and how it will always be.
And no I am not James Tanner lol just someone loving being at the centre of the hockey universe.
I’m pretty sure you are . Identical views on the leafs , the thick thick blue
For a third time Freddy record in playoffs was 17-9 with multiple rounds won . You make it sound like this isn’t a Toronto issue lol . He was just fine in Anaheim when the lights were bright .
He was the mvp for 2/3 last years and main reason for getting to the playoffs . Worn out and overplayed , with little to no help in front of him . Yet you continue to blame him and think any pulse will be the solution
Does Tanner hate Andersen too?
What does it say that the center of the hockey universe hasn’t won in like a 100 years? And that they are so obsolete as an opponent no one really can consider them a true rival anymore?
Well maybe Buffalo.
Where the Hell is George???
Uwey, you are right, where is he ? Wait, i’ll make him come out 🙂 George can you enlighten me and explain to me why you were comparing Domi and Cheechoo, one is a goal score, one is a playmaker… You really think Domi will be that bad ? That should do it lol
Was thinking the same thing. Hope all is well with you George O.
If Krug walks Boston has some cap space. Instead of overpaying a big fish I would rather use the money on 3-4 decent players to fill the roster. I’m not moving Carlo or Debrusk too much upside on a aging roster.
Anyone think that maybe AP is using the leafs as a negotiation tactic with St. Louis like Stamkos and Doughty did with thier re. Seems the popular ploy by Agents these days.
Yes I mentioned that a few days ago. I wouldn’t count out St. Louis just yet.
I also can’t see him signing for less than 5-6 years and at around $8m per might be a lot for most teams.
Last, he’s a great player to have and will improve any team…is he a final piece? I don’t know.
Anyone think that maybe AP is using the leafs as a negotiation tactic with St. Louis like Stamkos and Doughty did with thier respective teams. Seems the popular ploy by Agents these days.
Flames will have some money by not signing Brodie and Hamonic. Combined salary will equal the demand of Pietrangelo. A possibility . Without having to trade a player.
Have to agree with Pengy: Avs can’t add Petro without trading Johnson. Even then, I’m not sure it’s a good idea to sign a guy who’s going to be 31 in January to a 7 year deal worth north of $8mil. I’m not sure it makes sense financially or personnel-wise. Byram may not be ready this season (or maybe he will be ready) but they can stand to lose Z and bring in a cheaper vet who can play 3rd pair for a year or two.
If I’m Sakic, I know I have a really strong team right now so maybe I do what Lyle suggests and go get a guy like Markstrom or Andersen. I trade Z’s rights, sign Jost to a short-term deal, sign Burakovsky for 3 years. Then, I sign a solid veteran, 3rd pair D, shore up my bottom 6 and PK with affordable vets then lie in wait for the trade deadline. Now I’ve made my team better all over the roster, not just at one position for a bit more than Petro and I’ve maintained some flexibility for the big contracts of Landy, Makar and Mac. Heck, you might even convince Hall to sign a short-term deal for a chance at winning.
To me, that sound smarter but I’m not an NHL GM so what do I know?
Here’s a quote from Karine Hains, the Habs blogger over at “Buzz” (I know, he’s a complete idiot, but many of the team bloggers are very good, including Karine who is super).
She’s quoting Alan Walsh, the well-known agent:
“ Karine Hains
Today @ 8:50 PM ET
Interesting Tweet by Allan Walsh:
I’m shocked at how uninformed this take is-
1. Players in Canada can set up a Retirement Compensation Agreement (RCA) and limit their tax liability to a flat 20%. With sound tax advisors, a NHL player can actually pay the same or less tax in Canada than he will Florida or Vegas.
Funny since Montreal is always saying taxes is part of the reason why they struggle attracting top free agents…”
I offer this as an fyi.
I’m not an Accountant.
It’s a shame many of the writers over there get flack cause of the proprietor of the establishment.
Karine Hains is an excellent hockey writer. I really appreciate her work.
I liked reading Tanner as well, although his overall knowledge of the game was seriously lacking, I enjoyed his shtick. He could get the absolute worst out of some clowns. It was a thing of beauty actually.
Mike Pilon – The Canadiens would do that trade in a heartbeat for several reasons. First, they would get a proven scorer who can help next year. Caulfield may not pan out, and if he does, it may be another 2 or 3 years before he does. Same thing with the pick – 3 to 5 years before he is probably ready to contribute, if ever. And then there is the size thing. Montreal is small – as is Detroit – and Mantha is 10″ taller than Caulfield, and outweighs him by what – 50 / 60 lbs. ? As for Domi at center on the 4th line – why was he there at all ? The Canadiens were desperate to score against Philly, but found 3 other centers better ? Where do you think he would play here ? Center, of course – if he were good enough to beat out at least one of Montreal’s other centers in their desperate quest to score goals.
A proven goal scorer who has only hit the twenties twice?
First I have heard of this, rattis. I looked up Retirement Compensation up and this is what it says on the government website.
Withholding and remitting
If you are an employer and you set up a retirement compensation arrangement, you have to deduct a 50% refundable tax on any contributions you make to a custodian of the arrangement and remit the amount of refundable tax you collect to the Receiver General on or before the 15th day of the month following the month during which it was withheld.
Usual government argot but 50% is a lot different from the 20% Walsh mentions.
I am not an accountant either …
https://ca.rbcwealthmanagement.com/documents/17271/17295/Reitrement+Compensation+Arrangements+%28RCAs%29%20for+NHL.pdf/2588c228-c37c-4cfa-8307-4c39321769b9
I’m too lazy to read it on NFL Sunday.
Thanks, Uwey, but I injured myself trying to read it.
I think Bergevin should offer Charles Hudon, the STL 2nd, 2020 and MTL’s 4th 2020 To Vegas for Alex Tuch and Ryan Reaves.
Or just 2 2nds for Tuch
Ryan Reeves is a nice insurance to make sure no one touches your 1/2 punch of the future in Kotkaniemi and Suzuki.